In my experience, most everyone thinks the hardest deer to hunt are the ones that live in the place they hunt.

Whitetails in wilderness-like areas tend to freak out more at the sudden appearance of humans and get out of town. In a sense, they are warier.

At the same time, farm country deer, who are used to the presence of humans, have learned to craftily avoid them. Their hunter-avoidance tactics are honed from experience, and, IMO, they're more likely to quickly adopt nocturnal behavior when pressured.

 

If you look at the percentage of hunters who harvest at least one deer in the SLP vs. the NLP, it's 50% vs. 37% (based on 2007 data) and the SLP percentage is higher regardless of the sex of deer harvested or weapon used. So either as a group the SLP hunters are significantly more skilled then NLP hunters or else it's easier to kill a deer in the SLP. Which answer you choose is probably dependent upon where you live.

 

If you can read dear sign both are easy if all you want is immature deer and both areas are hard as hell if you are hunting mature deer.

 

If you look at the percentage of hunters who harvest at least one deer in the SLP vs. the NLP, it's 50% vs. 37% (based on 2007 data) and the SLP percentage is higher regardless of the sex of deer harvested or weapon used. So either as a group the SLP hunters are significantly more skilled then NLP hunters or else it's easier to kill a deer in the SLP. Which answer you choose is probably dependent upon where you live.

I don't know the numbers but from what I have read it sounds like there are more deer in the SLP so do you think that might be the reason for a higher hunter success rate?

 

I'm sure that is part of the reason, more deer = easier hunting.

 

I agree with that, but I also believe that farmland deer do not become alarmed by the sight and smell of humans the way that wilderness deer do. I live in farm country, and have deer feeding within shooting range quite often while doing yard work. They just don't seem to act like that up north.

 

I agree that deer in different places act differently. They pattern humans and when the patterns get broken, they know something is up.

Farm country deer are used to farm activity. Farmers keep away from deer areas most of the year. Once hunting season rolls around, the farm activity pattern gets broken. Now there is human pressure in deer areas and the deer react, or die!

Big woods deer are spread out over a larger area than thier woodlot cousins. This element alone makes the deer harder to find. These deer live in romote locations that dont get much human pressure at all. Once their daily peace gets broken by the sound of a heavy footed hunter, they sneak out escape routes and leave the area for a few days. This can lead to frustrated hunters in big woods areas.

 

I don't know the numbers but from what I have read it sounds like there are more deer in the SLP so do you think that might be the reason for a higher hunter success rate?

Also slp probably has more total hunter hours logged. From my experience they are the same animal. Scouting can be easier in farm land, due to being easier to watch the animals from a distance. Where I hunted in the NLP(luzerne) stateland I had good success just hunting deer sign. I have not hunting NLP enough to say 100% , but it seemed the NLP deer gave better reponce to calling.

 

As a few have said, I dont think it is a matter of the deer being less smart its more of a matter of there being way more deer in the SLP giving the hunters in that area many more chances to get a deer.

 

I believe it can be quite different from one parcel to the next.......Having said that, I believe the population in any given area would be the main factor that would contribute to hunter / deer encounters. More encounters = greater chance for success.

 

A deer is a deer, The difference is a product of the environment that they live in. The difficulty of hunting deer in northern michigan are due to low density, cover and weather, and locally high hunting pressure.

here is an example. I have some friends(a couple live here) that hunt the St Johns/ maple river area. Depending on conditions they either hunt corn rows or fields/river edge from elevated shacks, They expect to see approx 20+ deer a day. And they fill every tag, every year. it always includes a few big ones......

Our group hunts deep in the Roscommon County deadstream 3 1/2 miles by airboat Plus a 1/2 mile walk(tall boots) to my closest stand. If I see 1 deer a day thats good, 3 would be a great day. We dont have doe permits there. So in the roughly half of a season that I hunt there this year I saw about 8-10 deer, 1 that I could identify as a buck. no shots

In the other areas we (2 guys) hunted this year Mainly crawford county were we did have 1 doe permit each (the third one I have drawn in my life) Again we would expect to see 0-3 deer a day(usually toward the low end) We both filled our doe tags, by the way the doe tags are tb control as the LOW population in no way calls for doe permits. And both killed 1 1/2 y.o. bucks. 1 each. I saw 1 additional buck and maybe a dozen does in the non-swamp hunting, my buddy about the same. mostly around an active(being cut) clear cut or within sight of a game preserve. The time hunting would be at least 1 hunt (usually 2) every day of Rifle and M.L. seasons.

I dont think I even need to go into whats easier in my opinion, But I will tell you all this, We have an open invitation to join them in St. Johns, We have never done so. And are not interested at all in that type of hunting expierience. The 2 guys who do go down there to hunt now after hunting with us for years tell us that it is so easy its ridicoulus. To each his own I guess.

I would hope that this explains why the Hunters in the HEAVILY WOODED MOSTLY PUBLIC AREAS UP NORTH get defensive and or upset by the fine folks from the S.L.P. When they tell us what deer we should shoot or How many or when we should shoot it ...etc. etc. etc. 1 rule DOES NOT FIT ALL. And quite frankly most of us dont want your type of hunting up here.

I would think that the fact that many slp hunters come up here for deer camp for the expierience and to fill theyre "mulligan" tag would illustrate the difference quite well. I quite frankly dont care how you guys hunt or manage your property down there. TDM, QDM, whatever. But when you try to impose your ideas on the Northern 2/3 of the state EXPECT strong opposition.

 

Well said swampbuck,your response pretty much sums up my feelings

 

I think something can be said for hunting the terrain of "farmland" vs bigger woods. A 40 yard wide brushy fencerow is usually "easier" to hunt than a 40 acre oak stand. Or should I say, easier to get deer within sight or range.
Pinch points, funnels, etc and usually easier to locate in farmland than in unbroken big woods.
In archery season, it's easier, IMHO, to get deer within bow range in farmland with topography setup nicely for "cutting off" travel vs big woods. In big woods, you may see lots of deer, but they can be 100 yards away on one of many small trails.
While not always the case, since deer can cross fields or do about anything, I think it's easier to narrow down where the deer will likley go in farmland.
I also think that's a large part of why baiting was so big in NLP unbroken woods and no so much in the SLP. Sure, lots of food in the SLP played a large part too. But NLP big woods make it tougher to get deer to walk in bow range. And that's why NLP bow harvests will drop and the rifle harvests will go up.
That's why I suggest timbering and clearing out the tops to create your own travel paths, if you own land in the NLP. Or, if you hunt public land in the NLP, find new recently timbered land, rather than just going back to the same old growth public land you've been hunting for years.
It's night and day, IMHO.

 

Speaking only for myself, I've hunted both north and south extensively. The south has definitely been easier to get a deer and I attribute that only to sheer numbers in the locations I have hunted in the SLP..

 

I think something can be said for hunting the terrain of "farmland" vs bigger woods. A 40 yard wide brushy fencerow is usually "easier" to hunt than a 40 acre oak stand. Or should I say, easier to get deer within sight or range.
Pinch points, funnels, etc and usually easier to locate in farmland than in unbroken big woods.
In archery season, it's easier, IMHO, to get deer within bow range in farmland with topography setup nicely for "cutting off" travel vs big woods. In big woods, you may see lots of deer, but they can be 100 yards away on one of many small trails.
While not always the case, since deer can cross fields or do about anything, I think it's easier to narrow down where the deer will likley go in farmland.
I also think that's a large part of why baiting was so big in NLP unbroken woods and no so much in the SLP. Sure, lots of food in the SLP played a large part too. But NLP big woods make it tougher to get deer to walk in bow range. And that's why NLP bow harvests will drop and the rifle harvests will go up.
That's why I suggest timbering and clearing out the tops to create your own travel paths, if you own land in the NLP. Or, if you hunt public land in the NLP, find new recently timbered land, rather than just going back to the same old growth public land you've been hunting for years.
It's night and day, IMHO.

I agree completely.........

One problem though, in many counties with large tracts of State or Federal land is finding these recently timbered areas. Often times on public land, when an area is timbered off.......The orange army moves in, and most of the more serious hunters tend to want to avoid the crowds.

 

I would hope that this explains why the Hunters in the HEAVILY WOODED MOSTLY PUBLIC AREAS UP NORTH get defensive and or upset by the fine folks from the S.L.P. When they tell us what deer we should shoot or How many or when we should shoot it ...etc. etc. etc. 1 rule DOES NOT FIT ALL. And quite frankly most of us dont want your type of hunting up here.

I quite frankly dont care how you guys hunt or manage your property down there. TDM, QDM, whatever. But when you try to impose your ideas on the Northern 2/3 of the state EXPECT strong opposition.

I've got to say, you've lost me. In post #1, the poster posed the question, as to whether SLP or NLP deer were harder to hunt.

Your post not only goes onto a tangent, but you make the claim that folks are telling you which deer to shoot, how many you should shoot, when they should be shot, etc. Who is ordering you around like this?

You say you don't want "your type of hunting up here", whatever that means. Who is suggesting that you should want a different sort of hunting where you choose to hunt?

And who is imposing ideas on the northern 2/3 of the state, and how are they doing it?

I'm not trying to be argumentative, I just don't understand what you're talking about.

 

I think something can be said for hunting the terrain of "farmland" vs bigger woods. A 40 yard wide brushy fencerow is usually "easier" to hunt than a 40 acre oak stand. Or should I say, easier to get deer within sight or range.
Pinch points, funnels, etc and usually easier to locate in farmland than in unbroken big woods.
In archery season, it's easier, IMHO, to get deer within bow range in farmland with topography setup nicely for "cutting off" travel vs big woods. In big woods, you may see lots of deer, but they can be 100 yards away on one of many small trails.
While not always the case, since deer can cross fields or do about anything, I think it's easier to narrow down where the deer will likley go in farmland.
I also think that's a large part of why baiting was so big in NLP unbroken woods and no so much in the SLP. Sure, lots of food in the SLP played a large part too. But NLP big woods make it tougher to get deer to walk in bow range. And that's why NLP bow harvests will drop and the rifle harvests will go up.
That's why I suggest timbering and clearing out the tops to create your own travel paths, if you own land in the NLP. Or, if you hunt public land in the NLP, find new recently timbered land, rather than just going back to the same old growth public land you've been hunting for years.
It's night and day, IMHO.

Any discussion like this inevitably involves sweeping generalizations. Back when I first hunted deer, it was in the NLP, back in the early 70's when there were fewer deer up there than there are today. Still, corridors of deer movement were identifiable, expecially along creek bottoms and edges of differing types of cover.

Over the last 20 years, I've hunted two different parcels of ground, both in the SLP. They may be atypical, but funnels and travel corridors are relatively difficult to discern on both of them, as both contained, or were part of, significant contiguous pieces of cover (200+ acres); though the cover type varied within them (tall and brushy weed fields, dogwood/willow thickets, immature woodlots, buttonbush swamps, cattail marshes, etc.). Owing to the abundance of contiguous cover, hunting is more challenging than it is in places where regular travel routes exist and are therefore more predictable.

 

A deer is a deer, The difference is a product of the environment that they live in. The difficulty of hunting deer in northern michigan are due to low density, cover and weather, and locally high hunting pressure.

here is an example. I have some friends(a couple live here) that hunt the St Johns/ maple river area. Depending on conditions they either hunt corn rows or fields/river edge from elevated shacks, They expect to see approx 20+ deer a day. And they fill every tag, every year. it always includes a few big ones......

Our group hunts deep in the Roscommon County deadstream 3 1/2 miles by airboat Plus a 1/2 mile walk(tall boots) to my closest stand. If I see 1 deer a day thats good, 3 would be a great day. We dont have doe permits there. So in the roughly half of a season that I hunt there this year I saw about 8-10 deer, 1 that I could identify as a buck. no shots

In the other areas we (2 guys) hunted this year Mainly crawford county were we did have 1 doe permit each (the third one I have drawn in my life) Again we would expect to see 0-3 deer a day(usually toward the low end) We both filled our doe tags, by the way the doe tags are tb control as the LOW population in no way calls for doe permits. And both killed 1 1/2 y.o. bucks. 1 each. I saw 1 additional buck and maybe a dozen does in the non-swamp hunting, my buddy about the same. mostly around an active(being cut) clear cut or within sight of a game preserve. The time hunting would be at least 1 hunt (usually 2) every day of Rifle and M.L. seasons.

I dont think I even need to go into whats easier in my opinion, But I will tell you all this, We have an open invitation to join them in St. Johns, We have never done so. And are not interested at all in that type of hunting expierience. The 2 guys who do go down there to hunt now after hunting with us for years tell us that it is so easy its ridicoulus. To each his own I guess.

I would hope that this explains why the Hunters in the HEAVILY WOODED MOSTLY PUBLIC AREAS UP NORTH get defensive and or upset by the fine folks from the S.L.P. When they tell us what deer we should shoot or How many or when we should shoot it ...etc. etc. etc. 1 rule DOES NOT FIT ALL. And quite frankly most of us dont want your type of hunting up here.

I would think that the fact that many slp hunters come up here for deer camp for the expierience and to fill theyre "mulligan" tag would illustrate the difference quite well. I quite frankly dont care how you guys hunt or manage your property down there. TDM, QDM, whatever. But when you try to impose your ideas on the Northern 2/3 of the state EXPECT strong opposition.

Swampbuck
I do not understand why you would continue to hunt in areas where you are not expecting to to see many deer or not have many chances if any at shooting a deer. I understand that hunting isn't all about killing but why not join your buddys in ST. Johns for a week of hunting. It will still be enjoyable, and from what you have said it sounds like it might be more enjoyable compared to where you continue to hunt. I think you should continue to hunt those tougher places but why not try another area of the state for a different experience.
Another thing, hunting an area of very low deer density doesn't mean the deer are harder to hunt. Example I used to hunt 10 acres in SLP, because I only had access to 10 acres it was hit or miss on the deer sightings. Some days I would see a dozen and then go days or weeks without seeing a deer. In nine years I saw 7 bucks while hunting, and had only 1 shot at a buck that I missed. I also used to hunt alot of state land and after hunting an area for a while with out much luck I would move on to find better areas (at least IMO) Sometimes that required alot of sprin/summer scouting on state land that was over 2 hours away from my home. I will tell you this, I have spots on heavily hunted state land that to this day would feel very confident of going back and hunting if ever needed to. This is because I put alot of effort into finding areas where other hunters would not go but deer would. IMO if I or any one else isn't seeing deer in their current locations they need to make a move.
So exactly what type of hunting do us SLP hunters have that you do not want?
Here is the hunting I exxperience. Lots of deer sightings while hunting. Lots of bucks sightings while hunting. (I pass upon at least a dozen 1.5 year old bucks a year) Our group sees quite a few 2.5+ aged bucks and usually harvest a couple a year. We all fill our freezers with does and we encourage everyone to shoot does because we have too many(saw over 150 12/31/08) I also have very enjoyable visits to the property during the off season while glassing the fields or video taping the deer as they come out to feed.
From the posts of many NLP hunters what I experience sounds like what they would like to see.

 

Farm,
They are sweeping generalizations. We are discussing the entire SLP vs the entire NLP. Generalizations are all we have.

That said, since we've timbered our place, and have very large corn fields right across the road. my property could now be considered more farmy that places in the SLP that are wooded and/or swampy and don't have big fields right across the road.

Only on basing my comments on my own personal experience.

If someone wants to try something completely different, try still hunting in south Texas brush country or sitting in ridge tops in Texas Hill country.

My point is, many regions offer quite different hunting (as far as how best to approach the hunt) in vast, general terms.

But even with those generalizations, I shot one of my best Texas bucks on what you might call a drive. In the Hill country, there's big ridges and boxed in draws all over the place. We did a 3 man drive on a draw with me at the top of it and 2 guys sneeking thru the bottom. I shot a very nice 10pt doing what is basically a mid-west 3 man push. You won't see that on many TV shows, in Texas. But guess what, it works.

 

It's obviously easier to get a deer in areas where densities are higher.

There isn't anywhere in the LP where it's easy to tag an antlered buck that's 3.5 or older, due to their scarcity.

 

A deer is a deer, The difference is a product of the environment that they live in. The difficulty of hunting deer in northern michigan are due to low density, cover and weather, and locally high hunting pressure.

here is an example. I have some friends(a couple live here) that hunt the St Johns/ maple river area. Depending on conditions they either hunt corn rows or fields/river edge from elevated shacks, They expect to see approx 20+ deer a day. And they fill every tag, every year. it always includes a few big ones......

Our group hunts deep in the Roscommon County deadstream 3 1/2 miles by airboat Plus a 1/2 mile walk(tall boots) to my closest stand. If I see 1 deer a day thats good, 3 would be a great day. We dont have doe permits there. So in the roughly half of a season that I hunt there this year I saw about 8-10 deer, 1 that I could identify as a buck. no shots

In the other areas we (2 guys) hunted this year Mainly crawford county were we did have 1 doe permit each (the third one I have drawn in my life) Again we would expect to see 0-3 deer a day(usually toward the low end) We both filled our doe tags, by the way the doe tags are tb control as the LOW population in no way calls for doe permits. And both killed 1 1/2 y.o. bucks. 1 each. I saw 1 additional buck and maybe a dozen does in the non-swamp hunting, my buddy about the same. mostly around an active(being cut) clear cut or within sight of a game preserve. The time hunting would be at least 1 hunt (usually 2) every day of Rifle and M.L. seasons.

I dont think I even need to go into whats easier in my opinion, But I will tell you all this, We have an open invitation to join them in St. Johns, We have never done so. And are not interested at all in that type of hunting expierience. The 2 guys who do go down there to hunt now after hunting with us for years tell us that it is so easy its ridicoulus. To each his own I guess.

I would hope that this explains why the Hunters in the HEAVILY WOODED MOSTLY PUBLIC AREAS UP NORTH get defensive and or upset by the fine folks from the S.L.P. When they tell us what deer we should shoot or How many or when we should shoot it ...etc. etc. etc. 1 rule DOES NOT FIT ALL. And quite frankly most of us dont want your type of hunting up here.

I would think that the fact that many slp hunters come up here for deer camp for the expierience and to fill theyre "mulligan" tag would illustrate the difference quite well. I quite frankly dont care how you guys hunt or manage your property down there. TDM, QDM, whatever. But when you try to impose your ideas on the Northern 2/3 of the state EXPECT strong opposition.

Why would you go 4 miles deep to see no deer. I have friends that hunt public ground near Higgins lake and see deer all the time. Would it not be better to hunt where the deer are then acting like you have to work so hard to even see a deer. The deer are most likely sleeping in view of your truck IMHO.Reminds me of an elk hunt I was on years ago in Oakland county Me and my buds hunted real hard we walked for miles we looked high we looked low we missed are families we ate what ever we could find after a week of hunting we thought HEY maybe there is no elk in Oakland county. So the next year we went to New Mexico and we saw elk, lots of elk. I guess we should have been more like you and kept hunting Oakland county and bitching about New Mexico hunters

 

Bucksnbows,

I am quite happy with the hunting in my area. It is very challenging of course that why its called HUNTING. My post was to illustrate the difference in habitat, deer density, and type of hunting and/or local resident desires between the two areas. From reading your posts I believe that you understand the differences between hunting the agricultural areas and the wooded natural areas. Many times I have been told to shoot does instead, well I just filled the 3rd doe permit I have ever recieved, hows that. As far as why I continue to hunt here, well I grew up here, learned to hunt here, and will probably die here. I have hunted downstate (ag areas)a few times when I was younger. didnt care for it. There is something to be said about hunting "up north". I think the amount of traffic in the northbound lane shows that.

farmlegend,etc.
As far as who is trying to change how we hunt. There is a constant stream of threads on here about ar, mars, obr, doe harvest , qdm, tdm, now food plots on state land etc. etc. etc. and how this is what Michigan needs to do. the vast majority of the push for change come from posters with an SLP location in theyre profile. The problem being that they are not suggesting the changes for the SLP, they are suggesting Changes for the whole state or in some cases the northern areas. Your efforts may be better directed at change by zone rather than the state as a whole.

let me give you an example that really pushed me over the edge.....

A couple of years ago there was a long drawn out discussion about the lindquist proposal, it went to the NRC. Pinefarm was the origin of the "hunters choice" idea/threads that I am refering to.

After much discussion the consensus was reached that it wouldnt work for the slp due to conditions there, but hey lets do it for the northern part of the state. I would suggest you review those threads and look at the location of those for and against the idea. Thankfully for the NLP the proposal was DOA at the nrc meeting,......... Eventually it was imposed on the UP. Now I know the claims that it had support, and I question those claims. To begin with the hunters who participated in the survey supported changes, not a specific proposal. Even in that survey support for changes fell short of the 66% threshold set by the NRC. Just last week Michigan Outdoors showed a segment where Bob Garner asked K. Charters about support and he stated it was 50/50. I would bet that he heard more from hunting camp owners and the Lindquist/up whitetails guys, than he did from the working stiffs for whom venison in the freezer really does make a difference. The license sales data will be out soon we shall see.

I have many more concrns and I and others have posted data from the DNR and other entities regarding disease,invasives,antler restriction etc. Invariably those concerns and documents are ignored or bashed but never discussed. Kind of like Mr. Spin ignoring the concerns expressed by othere in the food plots on state land thread right now.

Pumpfake,......... I hunt where I do for several reasons

1- To get away from the pumpkin brigade of flatlanders.

2- To hunt a less pressured area where deer act like deer. Including big bucks, My garage antler pile grows faster with those.

3- And mostly because I enjoy hunting the way it used to be.

If your buddies are Claiming to see numbers of deer even remotely close to what you see in the slp, then I doubt theyre claims. I SPEND A LOT OF TIME OUTDOORS. Unless they are on private huntable land, which is less than 10% of Roscommon county.............. The deer herd is about 10 dpsm here. not many deer herds around.

 

Swambuck
I know there is a difference in the type of hunting between the big woods and the Ag land. I also understand the enjoyment one gets being in the big woods. It is an all together type of hunting experience that to some is the type of hunting they enjoy for whatever reason. What I always liked about the big woods was the feeling of solitude. Of course I have only gun hunted once in the big woods and it was in the UP after thanksgiving so I did not run into the orange army. But I have bow hunted near Houghton lake for many years.
Now as for SLP trying to push QDM ideas that you say might be working in the SLP but are not always good for the entire state as a whole, I will have to agree and disagree with you. I agree that state wide regulations will not work as a whole, but the science behind QDM ideas will work. They may just have to be different depending on what the deer herd would require in different areas of the state. At the same time some regulations could work state wide. An example of what would work would be making the gun season later so that it wasn't during the "peak of the rut" to help protect all bucks when they are most vulnerable and easier to kill with a gun in which this will help promote a better age class , also a OBR would also help with age structure and buck to doe ratios. Some things that I do not think work state wide are some of the current regulations on anterless harvests. Some areas are in more need of more anterless harvest than others. That is something that needs to be done seperatly by dmu. IMO I think dmu's should be broke down into 4 sections (example: DMU 059-1,059-2, etc.) and then managed correctly for each section.
As for the MAR in the UP effecting those who depend on venision in the freezer, I look at it like this, hunting is a privilage not a right depending on hunting season to provide food for your family is like depending on your employer to provide overtime so you can survive. Neither is ever a guarantee only a bonus. I like to have at least 3 deer in the freezer a year, 3 will be almost gone by october, 4 will get through a full year most of the time, but I don't expect the freezer to be full every year, if I fill it cool if not I am buying meat at the store. Now I do not know all the ins and outs of what happened in the up with their regulations and don't really pay much attention to them either because I do not hunt there. But for some reason the state decided these regulations were needed or wanted by the majority of hunters/landowners.

 

Swampbuck,
OBR with a split Firearms opener would solve any regional conflicts. IMHO
Open the UP on Nov.15 and open the LP the Friday or Saturday before Thanksgiving.

Then everyone gets what they want. Yoopers get an opener before the snow is too bad and the LP gets the opener it should have. And anyone can shoot whatever buck they want. But it's one buck, and done for bucks until next year.

It's not 1960 anymore. There will be no influx of LP hunters going to the UP for a split opener. Not with OBR. And not with the busy modern world and limited time away. And not with the Michigan economy for the next decade. And not with LP hunters now being pretty happy with LP hunting, no matter how they whine. I can't think of anyone who'd give up their LP buck tag to go to the UP. Some 15 years ago, maybe. But not now. The UP has pretty much lost it's shine to pretty much all but the guys that already go there. IMHO Sure, there'll be a few replacements and new hunters there, but I'd expect the 10% of hunters to go to the UP now to be 8% by 2012 and 5% by 2020.

It isn't a time like 1960, where the UP was the place to be for deer. It's flip flopped now. If there's any influx of hunters traveling the bridge, it'll be from Yoopers coming down to the LP for that opener.

If we had statewide OBR, a split opener, increased antlerless opportunities for the southern 2/3's of the LP and ban bait statewide, I'd be a happy boy.

Part of the reason for broader rules is to keep things simple. That's why statewide simple rules work best. Trust me, I sold the better part pf $2 million in MDNR licenses. You can't believe how confused so many hunters are about the combo tag, antlerless rules, etc.

Look at Ohio and their simple rules. They have a better program, for the average hunter to figure out.

 

Pine farm, I agree on the obr and split opener, but the dividing line should be zone 2/3, not the entire lp. IMHO