[LabtechLewis]

Well, I was kind of waiting to hear other's reactions before I elaborated on mine to see if I'm off-base, but the tone of the author was very condescending toward deer land managers, his own readers, clients, and NDA members. He pretty much said most of us are a bunch of idiots that only want to cut corners and are suckers for every fad and marketing gimmick, just to shoot trophy bucks and make people jealous. I was very turned off before I even got to anything about hinge cutting.

This opening paragraph is so far from describing my attitude and behavior that it doesn't even register on the "gets my dander up" scale.

This is poorly reasoned:

THE DRAW BACKS OF HINGE-CUTS
"I see it often with hinge-cutting. The landowner will complete a hinge-cut along an access trail and then complain about jumping deer every time they try to access their stand. By creating horizontal structure, which is often absent in mismanaged woodlots, they have conditioned the deer to loiter in that location."

#1, that is not a tactical problem, that is a strategic problem rooted in poor planning. Any "quality" professional would know that.

#2, say that DOES sound like a horrible tactic! Why, it conditions the deer to hang around!

I'm not spending any more time critiquing this click bait article.

 

[Gily]

An article like this really hurts their credibility in my eyes. Makes one wonder if the author's attitude toward his readers is a reflection of how NDA looks at us too.

Agree. And this credibility gap is also why this forum and the content covered here is so valuable. Real people, real experience. Real results. I love you guys……. Like brothers…. Like brothers, I meant!

Don’t trust anyone who writes for the mainstream. Fake deer news. The fake deer news just doesn’t get it, do they? They don’t.

 

[Osceola]

Agree. And this credibility gap is also why this forum and the content covered here is so valuable. Real people, real experience. Real results. I love you guys……. Like brothers…. Like brothers, I meant!

Don’t trust anyone who writes for the mainstream. Fake deer news. The fake deer new just doesn’t get it, do they? They don’t.

Okay, Gily. How many beers did you have before you wrote that? 😆

 

[Gily]

I’m vino veritas. (In wine there is truth)

 

[Bob S]

So, have any of you expressed your opinion of the article to NDA or Lindsay Thomas?

 

[Osceola]

So, have any of you expressed your opinion of the article to NDA or Lindsay Thomas?

Yes. I have.

Just to clarify, I am a supporter of Quality Deer Management. As the standard bearer for QDM, I've been a dues paying member of QDMA/NDA for decades. I figure my $35 gets me a quality magazine with objective, evidence-based deer management information and helps spread the QDM message to others.

I'm just having my doubts now about the quality of the magazine and whether they see me as a valuable member or just a dolt with a wallet, like Vucurevich.

 

[Dish7]

Alright I looked up this zack fella, he is a wildlife biologist of course he hates hinge cutting & invasives.

I would have guessed forester. I asked the local forester to come to my woodlot to advise me a few years back. He had been suggested to me by the local QDMA as the one to use. I told him that my goal was better deer habitat. As we began our walk through, he asked me in a very snarky way, "why I wanted more deer and just how many I needed to see?" Huh? Then he spotted a small hingecut and told me how bad they were and difficult it is to retrieve down deer from them. Again...huh? He really wasn't interested in much more then board feet and pointing out a few invasives that I already knew about. Garlic mustard and AO.

 

[FREEPOP]

 

[bioactive]

So, have any of you expressed your opinion of the article to NDA or Lindsay Thomas?

Yes. I sent Lindsay a strongly worded text spelling out how extremely dangerous it is to have a guy telling people to hinge cut by cutting 1/2 through a tree. And I expressed my displeasure at the smug, superior, virtue signalling attitude of the writer. I ended by telling him this does no reflect well on NDA.

You know, a few years ago a portion of my estate was to be left to the QDMA in my will. Since the formation of NDA, and the deterioration of the organization, that is no longer in place. It will go to other, worthwhile causes.

I hope everyone who reads this thread will express their feelings to NDA. They have gone so far downhill I doubt it is recoverable.

 

[Hillsdales Most Wanted]

if I owned 1000-2000 acres just maybe I'd be interested in talking to a forester(doubtful). But being a small land owner trying to create a whitetail paradise there's no room to listen to a wildlife biologist or forester. That's just my opinion but I cringe every time someone suggests hiring a forester.

 

[LabtechLewis]

So, have any of you expressed your opinion of the article to NDA or Lindsay Thomas?

I did not feel compelled to respond to top leadership. Everyone has an off day. It's a magazine article. I'm sure the simple fact that someone is discussing it publicly checks at least one of the boxes for the author and editor. I responded on this thread because I like critical thinking. I've seen similar flash points exist on this topic in the Habitat Chat fb group. I have no idea why it is so polarizing, but it seems to be.

In the interest of "objective journalism", there is an article in the same QW issue discussing aging by TWAR and CA. I think it is solid and lines up with my experience. Speaking of fb groups, I recently saw a post on another of my favorites totally denouncing both techniques. I found it disappointing and confusing. Again, everyone has an off day. Maybe through experience the author will rethink that position. I know there is nothing that a lowly particpant, like me, could do to persuade otherwise so it isn't worth spending the time to craft a response in that case either.

 

[Dish7]

if I owned 1000-2000 acres just maybe I'd be interested in talking to a forester(doubtful). But being a small land owner trying to create a whitetail paradise there's no room to listen to a wildlife biologist or forester. That's just my opinion but I cringe every time someone suggests hiring a forester.

I have nothing against foresters per se. My complaint about my experience was that I was told that this guy was the "go to" for whitetail habitat, when in reality, it wasn't his thing. The reason for a whitetail habitater to hire a forester is to take the first step in getting sunlight into a woodlot. Might as well get your money from logging the sellable trees first. I would think a forester is a very good idea for helping in a tree sale. Who would you rather trust? A forester or a logger?

 

[Gily]

About 7 years ago I actually hired a logger who had a forestry degree. Beware! That’s taking a chance on someone who knows exactly how bad they are taking you to the cleaners! In the end it worked out ok (as far as I know) but in the future any logging effort I do it’d be nice to have a third party forester with no skin in the game, keeping an eye on the logger and directing traffic. I just won’t listen to his recommendations on hinge cutting techniques. Just nod my head and smile politely.

Then I’ll hit you guys up for the real advice!

 

[Hillsdales Most Wanted]

I have nothing against foresters per se. My complaint about my experience was that I was told that this guy was the "go to" for whitetail habitat, when in reality, it wasn't his thing. The reason for a whitetail habitater to hire a forester is to take the first step in getting sunlight into a woodlot. Might as well get your money from logging the sellable trees first. I would think a forester is a very good idea for helping in a tree sale. Who would you rather trust? A forester or a logger?

If u can find a forester that will get enough trees gone to accomplish sunlight to the floor then cool, also no 30 year programs. Looking at getting a logger for this summer. Will be 3rd time with a logger, no forester.

 

[Dish7]

If u can find a forester that will get enough trees gone to accomplish sunlight to the floor then cool, also no 30 year programs. Looking at getting a logger for this summer. Will be 3rd time with a logger, no forester.

In the end, the forester and logger work for me. It's in the forester's best interest to sell as many as I want gone. They do get a percentage. I won't pretend to know current tree values whether it's high value or pallet wood. Maybe if you had used a forester, maybe you wouldn't be on round three. You don't seem old enough to be logging the same woods three times, lol.

 

[Hillsdales Most Wanted]

In the end, the forester and logger work for me. It's in the forester's best interest to sell as many as I want gone. They do get a percentage. I won't pretend to know current tree values whether it's high value or pallet wood. Maybe if you had used a forester, maybe you wouldn't be on round three. You don't seem old enough to be logging the same woods three times, lol.

Different properties.

 

[jmich24]

I hired a forester to write my forest management plan. Helped me include many NRCS Cost share projects. Used the foresters tree survey to estimate Timber Tax Basis. Will save me thousands in Capital Gains Tax.
Free Money!
I did the bidding with the loggers myself. The property wasn’t lucrative enough for the forester to get involved. I had 5 loggers walk the property.
1st not interested
2nd not interested.
3rd interested, but wasn’t receptive to my plans.
Low bid. No landing spot. High grade the timber and pull the logs to the road.
4th receptive to my plan. Low bid based on my needs
5th bid more than 2x other bids. Receptive to my ideas. Landing site was doable.

Down payment check cashed. Starting this week.
🤞

 

[Heehaw]

if I owned 1000-2000 acres just maybe I'd be interested in talking to a forester(doubtful). But being a small land owner trying to create a whitetail paradise there's no room to listen to a wildlife biologist or forester. That's just my opinion but I cringe every time someone suggests hiring a forester.

I’m just the opposite, I cringe when I hear joe blow woodlot owner selling trees without a consulting forester.
Without knowing the timber market and value of different species you are potentially asking the fox to watch the hen house by having a logger or timber buyer tell you what the value of your trees are.

 

[Hillsdales Most Wanted]

I’m just the opposite, I cringe when I hear joe blow woodlot owner selling trees without a consulting forester.
Without knowing the timber market and value of different species you are potentially asking the fox to watch the hen house by having a logger or timber buyer tell you what the value of your trees are.

Of course u don't want ripped off but removing the amount of trees I want to create deer habitat is more important than money.

 

[Osceola]

I think we may have been too hard on Zach Vucurevich. I listened to him on a podcast and he doesn't sound anything like the QW article. He may have just been trying too hard to be clever and came off as an a-hole instead. The QW editors blew this one, in my opinion.