Michigan Sportsman Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.

Other Rivers

3K views 32 replies 19 participants last post by  dinoday 
#1 ·
What is the reason that only certain River can be mentioned in this forum ? I don't mean to complain or stir up trouble, I just don't understand the rule. There are many other Rivers in Northern Michigan and many people who fish them. There is no other forum that I am aware of where these rivers can be discussed. Anybody North of Traverse City is excluded from talking about their local streams, not to mention those of us who don't always fish the "Big" Rivers. There are individual Rivers that I have caught more fish out of than all of those I cam mention combined and I'm not sure why we can't talk about it. Could we get a new forum for other Northern Michigan Rivers?
 
#2 ·
I know Whit1 has more insight to this than me,but I think the biggest reason is a lot of the smaller rivers don't need the pressure that 13,000+ members not to mention non-members could put on these smaller fisheries.
If you were to post a specific on river X where you pulled in a fair number of fish today I would bet the farm you'll see a whole lot of unfamiliar faces there in the days to come.
You can post on them,just don't name them:)
 
#3 ·
The decision on what rivers can be named and discussed is a subjective one. The reasoning for this rule is based on the premise that if they are mentioned, the added pressure will somehow cause them harm. I understand the logic, but I disagree with the practice too.

Personally I have learned not to mention where I fish because this added pressure from listing that information on this web-site can be staggering. This site has become a target for people who only come to learn where the hot bite is and just lurk as guests. That means they never contribute any information. What I am saying is that even though I disagree with the rule, I don't name them if I could because of the added pressure that will surly result.

Some of the bigger rivers I will mention, like the Muskegon, the PM, the Grand and the Big Manistee because they can take the pressure. Why go north of Traverse City when you have the Boardman river right in town. My son lives there, and catches lots of trout and steelhead right in the downtown area all the way to the dam just a couple of miles upstream.

I don't fish it much anymore because I don't care for the urban fishing and upstream there are many cabins. You almost have to go way up on the South Branch to find any solitude. Anyway there is no reason not to discuss the fact that you fished a north west river. Once you get to meet people they will know what your talking about and when you get into a group that you can trust, it is an excellent way to share information via PMs and I'd say that is what most people do.
 
#4 ·
Splitshot said:
Once you get to meet people they will know what your talking about and when you get into a group that you can trust, it is an excellent way to share information via PMs and I'd say that is what most people do.
Well said :)

And you can learn a lot from some of our excellent picture takers;) :lol:
 
#6 ·
I've seen in my short time on this web site, that lots of guys just want to probe you for your information. In other words, lets say i fish a small less know stream and post about it. I'll have several guys wanting to know the name, location, time of day, patterns, etc. First of all, im sure we all have our favorite streams and holes, but if you start sharing that info how long before your hole gets crowded or fished out?
Lots of the smaller streams cant support much fishing pressure for many reasons. Location, size, tempature, to name a few. Add a few to many new fishermen to that river and the quality can go down.
The Manistee, Au Sable, Boardman, Pm to name a few are well know waters that most everyone who knows fishing should know these waters. They are larger water that can afford the pressure(as long as we use the resourse
properly). So what i think is that if you have a favorite river and its not on
the list to talk about than that should be good news for you! Hopefully, you
will be able to enjoy "your" river with out added pressure from a bunch of us who just got the info off of MS Sportsman.

As far as myself, I live in metro Detroit, when i do get a chance to get up to my cabin and enjoy a few hours on the water i like to have it to myself
as much as possable. Though i have met many fine fella's along the Man. or Au Sable and have enjoyed comparing notes, i still prefer to have the water
all to myself.
 
#7 ·
as far as these "certain" rivers go...

i dont believe the "hype" either...

2 summers ago on a smaller tributary down south NOT one word was mentioned about that trib on ANY of the major fishing websites for the state of michigan(or anywhere else for that matter) and to my amazement the water was packed!!!:yikes:

im sorry but when you go kayaking to get away from the crowds and count 28 driftboats going by it reminds you of the PM in the middle of a heavy salmon run...

so i too don't believe in the hype...

it may sound mean but in the 5 years i have been a member here the site has changed alot...

and with that being said the number of members has more than doubled...

the problom isn't these sites...

it is how popular fishing/hunting is becoming...

nowadays instead of corporate golf outings you have guided corporate outings on the big manistee, PM or muskegon...

im not complaining because i know everybody has to make a dollar too...

but with that being said you have to accept that these "small" waters will have pressure too...

whats gonna be next threatening the local bait shops because they are giving out too much info???

its like a select group that is trying to keep 6th st. dam a secret:lol::rolleyes: ...

i dont know about you but in the 2nd most populated city in the state, you have to expect that "spot" to "grab" some attention...

anyways i respect what the admins and mods want to maintain as status quo...

its not my website and they put in the hours to keep it up and running...

cya on the river,

mark
 
#8 ·
There isn't a secret fishing hole out there, those days are gone. I know most of the NW rivers like the back of my hand, the only way to score is you have to be there on the right day.

How many times have you heard the saying, "You should have been here yesterday"? That is steelhead fishing these days, it is rare to see more than a couple days in a row of great fishing.
 
#10 ·
Fletchman said:
There isn't a secret fishing hole out there, those days are gone. I know most of the NW rivers like the back of my hand, the only way to score is you have to be there on the right day.

How many times have you heard the saying, "You should have been here yesterday"? That is steelhead fishing these days, it is rare to see more than a couple days in a row of great fishing.
Enlighten me please. Since you know the spots and live up there please provide me with a half dozen of your favorite places (stream names, holes, locations)for Brooks and Browns. Me and a bunch of weekend warriers from metro Detroit would welcome the chance for you to put us on the fish!!!
Thanks in advance!
 
#11 ·
That may be true, but I still fish plenty of places and rivers and most often I am the only one fishing. But maybe you mean on opening day. I once knew a guy who knew the rivers so well, he could tell from a picture exactly where you were and he had been trout fishing the area for at least 2 years.

I can't tell if your a jr. high school student or crafty fisherman since there is nothing in your profile.

Mel, good retort. There are plenty of places to fish and all you have to do is look for those out of the way places of which there are many and it will pay off. By the way as far as I'm concerned it doesn't matter where your from.

Good luck!
 
#12 ·
I think that part if not all of the fun of fishing / hunting is doing your homework and exploring new areas to fish and hunt....who can count the number of hours that we spend looking at maps and researching areas. I don't care that this site dosn't talk about every stream and ditch in michigan and gps cords of the holes and jams shouldn't be posted........they should be PM'd directly to me...:lol:
 
#15 ·
Simply mention the place you "hammered" 'em on the internet and there will be a sudden influx of new folks in your fishing spot. There are no real secret spots anymore but the internet sure is a good way to pass good news to alot of people. There may be 13,000 members, but I would hazard a guess that there are double that who read these posts and never register or leave messages. The internet is a giant billboard for all to see.

In other words if you like to meet lots of new people at you local "secret spot" then just mention it on the internet.

Brian
 
#16 ·
Fred,
Just out of curiousity, where did you get your info for that statement from? While I don't know if the overall number of licenses is decreasing, I do know that the popularity of steelhead/salmon fishing has exploded across the state and neighboring areas (Ontario, Pennsylvania, etc).

Personally, I think there are very few "secret" spots out there, however, if you look hard enough, you might be lucky enough to stumble across one of them. Some creeks and rivers just cannot handle the pressure that is associated with internet posting, whether it be first or second-hand information that is posted.
 
#17 ·
silversides said:
Fred,
Just out of curiousity, where did you get your info for that statement from? While I don't know if the overall number of licenses is decreasing, I do know that the popularity of steelhead/salmon fishing has exploded across the state


Hmmm? I disagree, I think the fishing sucks so bad the last 6 years that people are giving up. The Platte you can have whatever hole you want when you want. The Betsie isn't nearly as crowded as it used to be. Even Tippy you can find a parking spot and a place to fish.

Lets face it, the 70's and 80's steelhead fishin is long gone, and alot of the fishermen too.

I still rub elbows at Tippy and the Homestead every spring but it's not the same. Even my old surf fishing spots are slow, even with the best spawn.

I still get my fish, but it used to be alot easier.
 
#18 ·
I guess I can understand the reasons for not posting about certain rivers, I don't necessarily agree with all of them, but it's not my board and I don't make the rules so I will follow the posted rules.

As far as there being more fisherman, I don't think there are any more fisherman out there, but I do think that the people who are out there are more serious about it and fish more often than they used to. Also, you hear more about fishing through boards like this than you ever used to so it might just seem like there more people out there.

Just my 2 cents,
Matt
 
#19 · (Edited by Moderator)
Here for all your experts - look at this link and then decide if I am right or wrong.

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/NRCFAMinMay2005_126950_7.pdf


REVIEW OF DEMOGRAPHIC TRENDS - FISHING
Tammy Newcomb, Acting Assistant Chief, Fisheries Division,​
reviewed
demographics, recruitment and retention of Michigan fishers.
From 1999-03, there was a 6 percent decline in fishing license sales. Fishing
license sales peaked in 1987 and have been declining annually with the 22-40
age group declining the most. Restricted species are showing the greatest
decline in sales of approximately 19 percent. Approximately 30 percent of men
ages 25-65 purchase a license, and only 7 percent of women ages 21-60
purchase a license. Participation by anglers 60 and older remains consistent.
Nonresident license sales have declined 10 percent where non-resident-all
species license sales have increased 19 percent. Ninety percent of the licenses
sold are sold in-state.​
Ms. Newcomb​
reviewed items that influence angling participation: quality of the
fishery; weather; economy; competing hobbies; changes in family unit; and
changes in social patterns.
Bill Moritz, Chief, Wildlife Division,​
reviewed demographics, recruitment and
retention of Michigan hunters.
Fewer people are buying the most popular licenses. For example, between 1999
and 2004, 9 percent fewer deer licenses were sold; 12 percent fewer waterfowl
licenses were sold; 35 percent less elk licenses were sold; and 16 percent fewer
small game licenses were sold. Deer hunter participation has remained
consistent among the youngest hunters since 1970. Since 1981, there has been
declining participation in most other age classes and age class 55-64 is
increasing. A need exists to keep hunters interested and involved. For small
game, there has been a declining participation since 1960 among all age
classes.
A 20 year average (1960-79) of hunters shows that 2.4 percent of small game
licenses and 5.9 percent of deer licenses were sold to females. From 2002-04,
3.2 percent of small game licenses and 8.1 percent of deer licenses were sold to
females.​
 
#21 ·
I don't know why I'm getting sucked into this dead horse conversation but I cannot resist.


its a bunch of crap to say some rivers can handle the pressure and others cannot...the rivers that are listed are generally accepted as ok to post on are larger rivers but they get proportionally higher amounts of pressure. Has any one been out on their favorite river and said..gee it would be great if there were more fisherman in my favorite spots? I didn't think so.

I've been on the rogue when its empty and when its unbareably crowded. same goes with the grand, muskegon, manistee, little manistee, and etc...etc I really dont see a difference.

lets face it, many sites, even now guide's sites the majority of their traffic comes from report-voyers. so I doubt it that they are going to ban reports. It just seems a little bizzare to apply an uneven standard.

I've stopped doing report posts. if you don't like it when your river is crowded, I'd suggest leaving the river name out of you post.
 
#22 ·
After the the big blowup on this site I dont post reports but I think people who chase internet reports will soon be out of the game. People dont report secret spots. Many times I see a guide or other person on the river and read a report naming a different section or even river. A couple years ago I read a glowing report on a certain section of a river I had been snowmobiling on. Some people post reports in an effort to move or spread out the competition.
 
#23 ·
Splitshot said:
That may be true, but I still fish plenty of places and rivers and most often I am the only one fishing. But maybe you mean on opening day. I once knew a guy who knew the rivers so well, he could tell from a picture exactly where you were and he had been trout fishing the area for at least 2 years.
Good luck!
I know the same guy and remember his post about a photo that was shown in this forum. There was no mention of the river, but the Master Trout Angler knew exactly where the photo was taken.......or so he claimed. In reality the photo could have been taken on any number of streams all over Northern MI, including the U.P..........:lol:

As for the reason we limit the naming of rivers in these forums has been discussed by Splitshot, Dinoday, and others and they are correct. The site owner and mods have discussed this issue time and again, debating all sides and have come up with the present policy. The number of rivers that it is okay to mention has been updated within the past year.

If a succesful angler wants to give out information they may do so in PMs and emails of course, that is their decision to make.

Thanks Ray, Dean, and others for explaining MS' policy about naming rivers and specific holes.
 
#24 ·
I used to post alot of very specific valuable fishing information about a local river where I fish at.Like others have mentioned the lurkers have flocked to this site from all the publicity it generates just looking for info and not wanting to contribute.That can and should be changed in a way that only registered members can get info from this site.I have said this before but i feel the need to repeat repeat repeat myself.It doesnt take that long to fill out a short form to do this.Even so Im still relunctant to give out much info on where I fish and do so with vague discription.Internet fishing reports wether a day late or not do generate pressure on fishing spots especialy where I fish at.Being within an hours drive from the major population center of Se Lower michigan its easy for this place to get overwelmed by crowds.There is a need to limit names of certain places especialy small rivers.In closing im going to say that us "sportsman members" are lucky to have this site and be able to share info with one another.Sorry but I have no room for a lurker just gold digging the site for info.Its important for all of us to obey the rules and were lucky that we have this place to enjoy.Just think as the michigan-sportsman.com site as the information hiway for outdoor related info and you will understand why the rules are in place for posting on specific areas.
Aaron
 
#25 ·
The rule is very simple, if it's a place that Whit fishes, then it can't be mentioned. If it's a river that I fish, then most people seem to post a gazillion reports with lots of pictures--and usually Whit will say, "Good Job--keep 'em coming!" :lol:

Just having some fun, Mr. Whitmore! :lol: :p
 
#26 ·
thousandcasts said:
The rule is very simple, if it's a place that Whit fishes, then it can't be mentioned. If it's a river that I fish, then most people seem to post a gazillion reports with lots of pictures--and usually Whit will say, "Good Job--keep 'em coming!" :lol:

Just having some fun, Mr. Whitmore! :lol: :p
I've been accused of doing exactly that, and by members that I've gotten to know. Actually there are a few threads on the boards where I answered a member's questions about my favorite trout stream. :lol:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
You have insufficient privileges to reply here.
Top