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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Just reading about these new ML 50 cal pellets. Using 2 pellets will give 2,000fps with a 250gr bullet. Reading further, the new load will give more ME than a 30-06 with a 200gr bullet. Hope to try some out when they become available.
 

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WOW! If they work, I'm sure there'll be a ton of opposition from the law and traditionalists. I could never get rid of the scum ring from 777 in my gun. I wonder if it'll be worse with the Mag powder.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
no sulphur, and cleans up with just water. The only down side is, I only have a .45 Optima at present [sure they will bring the .45 pells out too] but, another reason to go buy another gun!:lol: .
On a good note, I did read the DNR is going to throw more antlerless tags out this year..........obviously looking to make some quick cash there....Ill buy a couple if they have them in our areas. Then I can use this old technology stuff again this year.
 

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i read where a lot of muzzle loaders shoot great patterns with 100 grains of 777 but when you add the 3rd pellet(150 grains) they shoot terrible. i have had this happen in my omega shooting 777..
i wonder if the mag. loads will do the same????????
 

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http://www.hodgdon.com/tripleseven/t7magnum.php

TRIPLE SEVEN MAGNUMS give you the capibility to make a longer shot and deliver more energy to the target. If you've shot Triple Se7en products before, you can expect the same easy clean up with no rotten egg smell. Using two Magnums you can achieve an additional 200-250 feet per second (fps). This normally results in muzzle velocities of approximately 2,000 fps.

Hodgdon specifically warns against loading more than 2 pellets per shot. Failure to do so may cause injury or death to the user and/or bystanders.

Used properly, this is an extremely safe high performance product.

While we are confident there are other muzzle loading rifles and saboted bullets that will acheive the 2,000 fps velocity, the ones listed below were tested by Hodgdon or the manufacturers and met or exceeded 2,000 fps with 2 (two) Triple Se7en Magnums
 

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So are they just a larger pellet (75gr. each) or are they a hotter powder?
Dave
 

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Drake said:
So are they just a larger pellet (75gr. each) or are they a hotter powder?
Dave
Can anyone please clarify.....

Been to the web site and see 2 different 50 grain boxes. One "BLACK BOX" 50 grain pellets. One "RED BOX" Magnum 50 grain pellets. What's the difference?

I don't understand please clue me in. I'm shooting the 777 50 grain in the "BLACK BOX". What the difference between these and the magnum load in the Red Box? Both say 50 grain equivalent.

My buddy (He's not hooked on the pellets yet...) is coming to town from out of state this Saturday and I really want to have some explination about these pellets when we go shoot on Saturday. Plus I'm all about a stronger charge if it's worth it.

Thanks for the info in advance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
That the NEW 777 pellets [labeled MAGNUM] is a new formulation. Thus giving an increase in velocity with the use of 2 pellets.
I dont use the 3 pellet load, Ive used just 2 which work fine. This allows an increase in velocity with just 2 pellet loading. The artical didnt say anything about what or if 3 pellets could be used in the "magnum" type guns.
 

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From Hodgdons site-
"Hodgdon specifically warns against loading more than 2 pellets per shot. Failure to do so may cause injury or death to the user and/or bystanders."

Seems pretty clear to me. It's the same as reloading pages that make you acknowlwedge that any use other than manufacturers recommend, is YOUR responsibility. Use at your own risk above 2 pellets.
Here's the list of approved ML's.


 

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or one could go to a smokeless muzzleloader, and shoot less than half the powder with half the recoil, and far less fouling, and still get 2000 fps. of course, fans of 777 have been able to surpass the 2k mark since its introduction - 150 grains and a 250 grain bullet will get you way over.

i can't wait until house bill 4554 passes and allows the usage of smokeless powder during muzzleloading season. what a senseless restriction.

what does a box of these pellets run? $30 for fifty shots? my goodness, hodgdon has a stranglehold on poor muzzleloaders these days, and smokeless powder = freedom. $24 gets me 140 shots, and i've got multiple powder makers to choose from.

gentleman, nothing comes without cost. you don't simply "re-formulate" and get 200-250 fps. it costs you something. fouling, recoil, pressure spike (which affects to accuracy), sabot stress (back to accuracy), etc. maybe all of those.

i'd be very skeptical about anything that comes out of hodgdon and their "quasi" smokeless brands. why does hodgdon so vehemently oppose smokeless powder in muzzleloaders? cause they have the corner on the market for an inefficient powder (that's why it smokes) that costs 3 times as much as the other options. don't kid yourself, there's good ol' nitro in that 777.

i'd continue to buy 777 in the powder version for the most cost effective solution, until i could save enough to buy a savage, an SMI conversion (encore or H&R), or a NULA, and shoot smokeless. chalk up the performance gains to marketing and money making.

(not that i'm knocking the performance of 777 in general - it remains, imo, the best option for muzzleloading season, in terms of accuracy, cleanliness and efficiency.)
 

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lol yah.......... thats why we have been running 4-5 of them for years now... and killed a lot with it. same for pyrodex.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
deputy said:
lol yah.......... thats why we have been running 4-5 of them for years now... and killed a lot with it. same for pyrodex.
But if one needs cannon preformance...there ya have it.
RZ-the simple truth to pellets is they load faster and dont require the extras of powder dispensing/loading. Its a faster way to load and guys like it. Also, a pound of powder costs 20 bucks? I doubt many of these guys shoot M/L as much as you do. Typically, Id bet it comes out just before season, sight in and maybe takes 3-5 times out hunting.
I know your hellbent on smokeless....thats all well and good, but time is everything, and I know my personal expirience is I want to load it quick and be done with it. My last box of pellets? I believe was 21.00 not much of an expense.
Indeed powder is improved and one only needs look at the powders used in the light magnums of today. These powders arent available to the general public. The new pellets only needing 2 is going to cause all these problems you list? I highly doubt it.
Why do I need a SMOKELESS M/L? I dont, traditional guns kill just fine. The Ultimates are great guns too. Having shot them, I like them, but havent a use for them. And, thanks to Don Rust from Ultimate for letting me shoot the gun at Williams a few different times.
Time is of a premium these days, and its all about speed and keeping things simple. If they say smokeless is fine, why bother with M/L at all.......might as well use the 30-06 again.
Gee, and all I have is that Optima 45.........It kills deer just fine.
 

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oh jeez, huntsman - don't make it into another one of those debates - "might as well be a 30-06", etc. that's a load of BS. you know as well as i do that smokeless gets you 2 things -

less recoil, and cleanliness.

i couldn't care less what you or anyone shoots. the average muzzleloader might shoot a half a dozen times a year - all the more reason to use smokeless powder. 777 and other subs, as well as black powder, absorb much more water over time, and aren't nearly as stable as nitrocellulose powder, which can stay good for years without changing exterior ballistics.

furthermore, from a time issue. i weigh 42 grain charges into a spent 30-06 case, and cap it. i need to load, and i pull the case out of my cartridge sleeve on the stock, and dump the powder in. guarantee that you can't load pellets faster. i've tried. hell, aa5744 and sr4759 can be dipped, instead of weighed! and they said that smokeless can't be measured by volume! you're telling me that weighing a dozen charges before the season - with all the loading you do - is somehow time prohibitive? gimme a break! how about this - save the time in cleaning after you shoot! i shot my gun all november and didn't clean it until february! try that with 777! not even a swab!

so before everyone quits reading this because of the same tired arguments regarding smokeless powder, let me say this:

i don't care if you want to use black powder. i don't care if you want to use 777 or pyrodex. of course they work just fine. but if you want to use a clean burning powder, that's been around for decades longer than any black powder sub, than recoils less, stores far longer, and costs 1/3 as much, then you should care about shooting smokeless powder.

just don't expect smokeless to do anything that black powder or black powder subs will already do. you're not getting any longer distance shots.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Im with you, I dont care what you shoot, recoil is part of shooting. Cleaning a gun? Ill clean it with or without smokeless. So the two points really are not valid reasons for smokeless usage.
But, I highly doubt when these M/L seasons were devised they were thinking of all these "advancements".
I wasnt really talking of me and loading my M/L as much as the average Joe that wants the loading process as quick and simple as can be.
I dont really care about storing powder be it BP or smokeless. I use it up and dont leave it on the shelf. Shelf life isnt important, I believe in using fresh each season.
Really, your last two sentances sums it up why we really dont NEED smokeless. We wont get into the roundball fray again. I know your not a traditional type M/L shooter.
I dont have a problem with powder selection or the guns, it just amazes me how far we have come from what WAS recognized as BP guns, to basically using modern rifles. The only thing missing is the brass casing.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
brother I never had [Kidding]. Really, I do agree with RZ more often than not. Most of our discussions revolve around the smaller faster bullets/ cartridges I like, and Rz`s like of the heavier slower bullets and cartridges he likes. In the grand scheme of things we probably wont change each others mind on that, but I do read and listen to others opinions.
And, to show good faith....RZ if you have some extra Berger 20 cal light gr bullets, I might be willing to swap you some of them for some of the Berger 20 cal 50 gr I have for testing.
Ill have a table up at Birch Run at the next show in Aug with a few friends there. And Quak.....please remit said comedy check to........
 
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