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There isn't a ecosystem, probably on the planet that hasn't been affected directly (cutting trees, adding roads, pollution, etc.) or indirectly (invasive/introduced non-native species, climate change, pollution) by man.

KW
 

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There isn't a ecosystem, probably on the planet that hasn't been affected directly (cutting trees, adding roads, pollution, etc.) or indirectly (invasive/introduced non-native species, climate change, pollution) by man.
KW
Pretty much YUP KW.

In addition I seriously doubt there are any "indigenous" ecosystems in Michigan that remain from 300 years before whatever your definition of "indigenous" is. Climite is continually on the change and all of these "presettlement" and "indigenous" timeframes are snapshots in time identifiying the conditions at that time. Here is a snapshot of about 10,000 years ago, bet most us are glad there is a little more water in the great lakes than then. Scroll down to the Mackinac Channel story...http://www.ngdc.noaa.gov/mgg/greatlakes/lakemich_cdrom/html/geomorph.htm
Here is the map at a readable size...http://www.ngdc.noaa.gov/mgg/greatlakes/lakemich_cdrom/images/area5hi.gif
 

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100 percent. and define original. from the ice age? the dinosaur period?
Ok then, 200% We have added more flora and fauna than we have taken away.

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The "indigenous ecosystem" that Ronnem is talking about is the boreal White Pine forest. Of that there is less than 1% left. FRANK
 

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The "indigenous ecosystem" that Ronnem is talking about is the boreal White Pine forest. Of that there is less than 1% left. FRANK
I'm going with what Frank said. I did learn it's not the Jack Pine.
 

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Here's some lessons:

Boreal forest info is here http://mnfi.anr.msu.edu/communities/community.cfm?id=10690

There realy isn't boreal white pine forests, boreal forests are usually spruce/fir in Michigan. White pine is a component in many forest comunities. White pine is a secondary succesional forest meaning it needs partial sunlight to thrive so it comes in after the early succesional species such as jack pine, aspen, spruce/fir. Our first indgenous speices after the ice receded was spruce, fir, and aspens. Without a time reference noone can answer this question.

Here is a list of Michigan's ecosysytems http://mnfi.anr.msu.edu/communities/index.cfm

One thing to keep in mind is that forest systems that are pre-settlement were developed around 1750 and that was during the "Little Ice Age" that ended in the early 1800's.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Here's some lessons:

Boreal forest info is here http://mnfi.anr.msu.edu/communities/community.cfm?id=10690

There realy isn't boreal white pine forests, boreal forests are usually spruce/fir in Michigan. White pine is a component in many forest comunities. White pine is a secondary succesional forest meaning it needs partial sunlight to thrive so it comes in after the early succesional species such as jack pine, aspen, spruce/fir. Our first indgenous speices after the ice receded was spruce, fir, and aspens. Without a time reference noone can answer this question.

Here is a list of Michigan's ecosysytems http://mnfi.anr.msu.edu/communities/index.cfm

One thing to keep in mind is that forest systems that are pre-settlement were developed around 1750 and that was during the "Little Ice Age" that ended in the early 1800's.


"Next to the Politician the college educated biologist/scientist is the most dangerous creature on earth."


And there are ecosystems that still exist in the world, but it is easier to say, move along nothing to see here, just europeans being europeans. Aboriginals(from the latin meaning original people) existed on all 6 inhabitated continents, living within their ecosystems. It only takes a european less than 200 hundred years to totaly change that.

The answer is 0% there is no acre in Michigan that is void of all invasive species and still containing the original ones in Michigan, none 0%, and no effort to bring them back.

Ron
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Here's some lessons:

Boreal forest info is here http://mnfi.anr.msu.edu/communities/community.cfm?id=10690

There realy isn't boreal white pine forests, boreal forests are usually spruce/fir in Michigan. White pine is a component in many forest comunities. White pine is a secondary succesional forest meaning it needs partial sunlight to thrive so it comes in after the early succesional species such as jack pine, aspen, spruce/fir. Our first indgenous speices after the ice receded was spruce, fir, and aspens. Without a time reference noone can answer this question.

Here is a list of Michigan's ecosysytems http://mnfi.anr.msu.edu/communities/index.cfm

One thing to keep in mind is that forest systems that are pre-settlement were developed around 1750 and that was during the "Little Ice Age" that ended in the early 1800's.
"Next to the Politician the college educated biologist/scientist is the most dangerous creature on earth."



And there are ecosystems that still exist in the world, but it is easier to say, move along nothing to see here, just europeans being europeans. Aboriginals(from the latin meaning original people) existed on all 6 inhabitated continents, living within their ecosystems. It only takes a european less than 200 hundred years to totaly change that.


The answer is 0% there is no acre in Michigan that is void of all invasive species and still containing the original ones in Michigan, none 0%, and no effort to bring them back.

Ron
 

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"Next to the Politician the college educated biologist/scientist is the most dangerous creature on earth."



And there are ecosystems that still exist in the world, but it is easier to say, move along nothing to see here, just europeans being europeans. Aboriginals(from the latin meaning original people) existed on all 6 inhabitated continents, living within their ecosystems. It only takes a european less than 200 hundred years to totaly change that.


The answer is 0% there is no acre in Michigan that is void of all invasive species and still containing the original ones in Michigan, none 0%, and no effort to bring them back.

Ron
:bowdown: Yes things ain't the same as they were 200 years ago. Things 200 years ago ain't the same as it was 200 years before that. But I'm sure you already knew that.. all knowing great one.:bonk: I'm just one of thems dumb college educated scientists.

Yes there are areas that don't have invasive species and are still very close to what was there 200 years ago. Also once the aboriginals arrived they made changes as well and had inpacts albeit proportional to their population. I really don't think it makes much diffeence if you are white or not that you try to survive and have an inpact. But then again all knowing one, that isn't fitting into your agenda:evil:.
 

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Even night-crawlers?
Ya, the sandy areas are almost devoid of any worms and I was on some solid bedrock areas looking for walking fern last weekend that was wormless.

One thing to keep in mind with this "trivia" is nature never stays the same, it is always a changing.
 
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