Thanks for the heads up. My son was asking what happened to that bill :lol: Of course, he is 13 and ready to go.

Dan

 

Well Dan everything was put on hold to work on the dove bill
Make sure you call tomorrow and spread the word to others, so we can get the ball rolling again.
I will be in Lansing on the 8th or 9th of July and I will stop by Senator Birkholz office, I'll grab the 3500 signatures we've collected on our petition to show her of the support we have

 

Sorry fella's...I won't support lowering the age, not in this day of violence, and irresponsibilities. Sure I know that most hunters, like you and I would responsibly teach our kids the proper things, BUT there are too many that don't care themselves, and won't do things correctly. The danger is way too great. I honestly believe that too many 14 year olds are NOT ready or responsibble enough to handle a firearm, and as a scoutmaster,this has been proven to me over and over the past several years. Most would not be able to make a good choce when buck fever hits. Blame it on society, on video games, on whatever you wish, Kids today are NOT as responsible as we had to be.

 

What is more sad is that you are going to try and make a parenting decision for ME! My son has been shooting since he could walk. I would much rather be out in the woods with him, than many of the so called "mature adults" out there with guns. I have been shot twice in hunting accidents. Both times these were by your "safe, mature" adults. One was 26 and the other was 40. What made them "old enough" to be safe???

Why shouldn't my son be allowed to hunt with a firearm for deer?? How can YOU make a value judgment on my son's maturity and responsbility?? You should let ME decide if he is ready, NOT you! Sorry for the rant, but I am very offended by your stereotyping and generalities!!

Dan

 

What is more sad is that you are going to try and make a parenting decision for ME! My son has been shooting since he could walk. I would much rather be out in the woods with him, than many of the so called "mature adults" out there with guns. I have been shot twice in hunting accidents. Both times these were by your "safe, mature" adults. One was 26 and the other was 40. What made them "old enough" to be safe???

Why shouldn't my son be allowed to hunt with a firearm for deer?? How can YOU make a value judgment on my son's maturity and responsbility?? You should let ME decide if he is ready, NOT you! Sorry for the rant, but I am very offended by your stereotyping and generalities!!

That same Stereotyping and generalities that you mention, ARE the reason I feel as I do. I KNOW that many, like yourself, are safe and smart, You and I BOTH also know that way too many so called Mature adults, are NOT. My worry is not of you and what you teach your son, My worry is what these so called Mature Adults WON'T teach thier sons...and Unfortunatly YOU and I both have to share the woods with these morons..

Unfortunatly, a simple fact of our society, is that too often, many kids are taught the wrong things by well meaning adults, that simply don't know better themselves, or simply don't care..

Yeah, its another case of a few spoiling things for the many, but, I have had close calls myself, and while I have never been shot, I have had a 14 year old shoot over my head while I was in full view,and in full blaze orange, sitting on the side of a hill, watching a buck come in.

I have also witnessed a young hunter nearly blow the head off a guy that was simply riding his bike on a open bike trail, the kid saw nothing but brown...(unfortunatly, HUNTERS are the ONLY people required to wear Blaze orange, Bike riders and Hikers are not required to do so.) I surely would not want my son, or yours, or any other kid, to be the one that made that fatal mistake, all due to over excitement.

Again, While I fully support you teaching your child the right things, We both know that not all "Adults" will follow your exemplary lead.

I am sorry, but I won't support lowering the age limits.

 

Good post One Eye my sentiments exactly.

My youngest daughter has been shooting a rifle since she has been very young. She has sat by my side for 8 consectutive deer seasons and is still not legally old enough to shoot a deer with a rifle.

We have patiently waited for her day to come, if it's not this year it will be next year when she turns 14. I could have let her drop the hammer many times but I won't teach her to be a violator. We can wait but she has been ready for several years now.

She is my favorite hunting partner and has earned the right to take a deer, if only in her fathers eyes. We have started our own tradition of spending Thanksgiving day and weekend hunting together. Her mother is not in full agreement with us missing a family holiday but has a hard time finding fault in our time alone at camp.

It should the parents decision if a child is ready to safely handle a firearm and possibly take the life of one of God's creatures. Oh yea, I do hope she can enjoy the rush of buck fever. I hope the day never comes where her father's heart doesn't skip a beat or two on an approaching mature whitetail.

 

This is a topic that I get a kick out of. The kid is old enough to hunt small game with a gun and bow hunt for deer, but he is not old enough to shoot a deer with the same gun he shot the rabbit with!

If the law is not changed I will take my son down south and hunt with him.
We will hang two tree stands and I will sit next to him and film his hunt.
The State of Michigan will miss out on the fee it would have collected for his hunting license and any other monies that I will spend in Kentucky. If my son does not fill his tag during the youth season we will be back for Kentucky's regular season.

If I have to make a choice of hunting in Michigan by myself or hunting in Kentucky with my son, I'll be heading south! :corkysm55

 

Yeah, its another case of a few spoiling things for the many, but, I have had close calls myself, and while I have never been shot, I have had a 14 year old shoot over my head while I was in full view,and in full blaze orange, sitting on the side of a hill, watching a buck come in.

I have also had adults shoot my way, and one of them actually shot me as a deer with a bow at dark. If I follow your logic, then no one should be hunting because there are a few idiots in the world. Try applying that logic to driving

I have also witnessed a young hunter nearly blow the head off a guy that was simply riding his bike on a open bike trail, the kid saw nothing but brown...(unfortunatly, HUNTERS are the ONLY people required to wear Blaze orange, Bike riders and Hikers are not required to do so.) I surely would not want my son, or yours, or any other kid, to be the one that made that fatal mistake, all due to over excitement.

Same argument as above. Did you report these incidents? Was the youth accompanied by an adult, as the law requires??

Here's another one. My son has turkey hunted the past 2 seasons. This is arguably one of the most dangerous types of hunting. The hunters are fully camoflauged and making the calls of the animals being hunted. My son can legally carry a 3 inch magnum 12 guage shotgun loaded with some of the most powerful shotguns loads made, but he cannot hunt deer with a firearm where all legal hunters are wearing hunters orange
How about his 22 rimfire that he can legally hunt small game with? Let's talk about the range potential of that weapon.

If you see ANY hunters behaving dangerously or illegally, then you should report them. If you do not, then you are at least a silent contributor to any potential accidents they may cause.

I hope this isn't really about not wanting to share the woods with additional hunters enjoying this great pasttime too???

Dan

 

.

If you see ANY hunters behaving dangerously or illegally, then you should report them. If you do not, then you are at least a silent contributor to any potential accidents they may cause.

I hope this isn't really about not wanting to share the woods with additional hunters enjoying this great pasttime too???

Yes Both incedents were reported immediatly, NO its not about sharing the woods, its about being SAFE in the woods. Look, I know that there are some kids that are mature beyond thier years, I applaude thier parents.

I also know far too many that aren't. THOSE are the ones that I worry about, the ones whose parents are not really hunters, but want thier kid to have the chance to "shoot something" The Parents that never take a deer, cause they don't have a clue about the woods, or the game,The ones that shoot only to sight in a gun, two days before season, the ones that want to make thier son a MAN, by killing something, THOSE parents want to be in the woods with thier kids, as much as you want to be there with your child. THOSE are the kids that I would not want out there, for the safety of myself, you, your child, as well as anyone else out there.

 

Millions of families take thier 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 8, 10 yr old kids hunting every year in TX, KS, LA, MS & others with zero problem. Are the other states parents too stupid to intelligently & safely guide their kids into the outdoors? of course not!!

 

TrailFndr I totally agree with you and your comments. I don't see why these others can't seem to understand where your coming from. Seems that they may be selfish for their kids and are totally ignoring the fact that there will be a lot more dangerous hunters in the woods. We need to find the age where there is a major majority of safe hunters to dangerous hunters. At 12 its most likely closer to 50/50 than at age 14. I for one do not want that many more dangerous people in the woods carrying a high powered rifle.
One Eye did you get my pm.

 

I do not see how there would be any diff. between 12 and 14 for big bame hunting. If the kids parents are doing a poor job at 12 don't you think they still will be at 14? Let them hunt at 12.

 

I've greatly enjoyed spending the last couple of years hunting with my nephew down in AL where he harvested his first deer at the age of 6 and then another at 7...both does.

 

If they are in the woods they are not in front of the T.V, which I think is a lot safer in this day and age.

 

I don't see why these others can't seem to understand where your coming from. Seems that they may be selfish for their kids and are totally ignoring the fact that there will be a lot more dangerous hunters in the woods.

I don't see where he coming from because the Facts point in the other direction. If any of you can show me statistics that lowering the age to 12 adds any increase to the amount of accidents or deaths... please do.

Neal

 

While Trailfinder has an opinion and he is entitled to it.
I disagree, and I have no kids of my own.
What would probably be best would be to have a required shooting proficiency test for "ALL THAT OBTAIN A LICENSE"
Besides anyone that hunts state land in southern Michigan during firearms season, well their just a little different :coco:

 

Some thoughts on age limits..without the emotion..

Right now, it is the parents responsibility as to whether or not a child may use a firearm for hunting. For small game it's 12, 14 for deer.

It is also a requirement that the parent be within eye contact and verbal communication of the child at all times. This probably won't change, but maybe ought to change to just being with the child, at least to age 16. That way, any kid can use a firearm because the parent is always right next to them. That should be either for small game or deer hunting. A gun is a gun no matter what you hunt. There should be no difference between what you hunt.

This is really how I brought my kids up and we only hunt private land. I always thought it was unfortunate that they could not start a little earlier.

The age in which a child gets to use a firearm with an accompanying adult should be essentially waved to whatever a parent thinks the child can handle. No age limit whatsoever. You cannot regulate a childs maturity and you certainly cannot regulate a parents.

I know for a fact that many kids should not have any access to a firearm at any age. My cousin refuses to take his 16 year old out with a gun until he feels he's mature enough to manage himself properly. My brother has a ten year old that is very safe and mature with a gun.

The question is who should make the decision. The answer is the parents. Not the legislature or the NRC or the DNR. Hunting is a family tradition that needs to be managed by the family.

 

These kids of today are not nearly as bad as everyone wants to make them out. Yes, they are different than they were 20 years ago, but so are you and I. I spend the majority of my day with 500+ kids who are 12-14. They really don't scare me and I find that those who have a love for the outdoors are the most responsible. If a child goes through a Hunter Safety Program, and hunts with an adult, then I'd have no problem hunting with them at a younger age. At least with most of the kids that age, they would not be under the influence while out in the woods. Heck, maybe we should put a maximum age limit on hunting. Ya know, the eyes go, the nerves are shot, and the ticker isn't all that great. :yikes:

 

Some kids are bad so lets not lower the age and that way we punish and turn many kids away from the sport we know and love lets also eliminate future voters from our sport because of a few idiots. While we are at it, lets eliminate guns in general because ther a a few people who are unsafe with them and we better do the same with knives and bows etc etc etc. It is like I am listening to Charles Shumer argue in the senate :yikes: Texas has kids out there shorter than the rifles they are hunting with and last I knew Texas still hadn't killed off the population because of hunting accidents from young kids. I think In my experience I have seen a lot more "ADULT IDIOTS" out in the woods with beer and so forth than kids. It is the kids who just got out of hunter safety who pay more attention than most of us JMO.

Lower it and take your kids hunting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :rant:

AW

 

As long as the parent is with in arms reach I would have no problem with any age. I would have to trust the parent.

 

if you honestly think waiting 2 extra years to be able to hunt will turn them away forever then you and the kid need help. Seeing that kids can't drive at 13 they get turned off and never want to drive right??? oh wait maybe not. If a kid gets mad to the point where he/she doesn't want to do it (hunt) then they are a spoiled brat that shouldn't deserve the right to hunt anyways. Why make sarcastic remarks when they don't even get your point across??


patience is a virtue.

 

All for lowering the age requirments for hunting. The kids would still have to be with an accompaning adult like always.

Reallity is: Teach a kid right and they will do right; choose not to teach them and they will be a disapointment. Age has nothing to do with deciding when someone is truly ready for a situation; we/they are all different and this decission should be left up to the parent.

 

I'll be surprised if the next thing under discussion isn't why don't we lower the age to drive, or how about the drinking age, or how about the age to buy cigarettes. Personally I think their are immature people at all ages. Partly the way people are raised, and or the crowds that they hang out with. Your son/daughter may be the most safest kid with a gun on the block, but what about the rest of the 12 yr. olds at their school. Likewise with driving a car, mine might be the most safest one on my block. But the kid down the road may drive like an idiot. The bottom line is some people are better parents than others. The problem is how do we tell which ones should be deer hunting with a high powered weapon @12, or driving a car @ 14, or drinking @ 18. Obviously the line must be drawn somewhere. But where. If you draw it to high you'll hear my kids a responsible shooter, or a responsible drinker and the laws should be lowered. And if you draw it to low you're going to hear I told you so.

 

Obviously the line must be drawn somewhere. But where. If you draw it to high you'll hear my kids a responsible shooter, or a responsible drinker and the laws should be lowered. And if you draw it to low you're going to hear I told you so.

I totally Agree with the above quote
to everyone else have you ever heard it's better to be safe than sorry. I think it applies nicely in this case.

 

I totally Agree with the above quote
to everyone else have you ever heard it's better to be safe than sorry. I think it applies nicely in this case.

AMEN!!