If you don't plan on breeding or competing then it is all just personal preference. However, one of the draws to buying papered dogs with performance and health tested pedigrees is one way that people can promote responsible breeding practices. Other than that, it is all just preference in my opinion.

 

When I am buying or getting a puppy, I figure on 12 yrs of expense. It would be nice to know the breeding was a planned one, with some expertise involved in finding two exceptional dogs.
I guess if the dogs werent papered, the $ value is close to free, even if the parents are good hunters.

 

If the parents arent registered, then your dog cant be registered either. So the question is mute.

I know a lot of hounds arent registered but bird dogs not so much.

NB

 

How important is it to have your dog papered? I plan on getting him fixed and I never plan on showing him in any field trials. So are there any other reason why I should have my dog papered. He does come from a pure bread back ground but neither parents are papered. Just thought I would send this question to you guys or gals.

Thanks Again for your input,

fulldraw

If you own a Pointer like some of us here do, then it might be worth it just to convince people who think they are GSP's that they are in fact not.

Seriously, if you're not breeding the dog or trialing it and it's not already papered, well, don't take this the wrong way but why bother? Unless you're looking for bragging rights about where the dog came from it's useless.

 

If you own a Pointer like some of us here do, then it might be worth it just to convince people who think they are GSP's that they are in fact not.

Seriously, if you're not breeding the dog or trialing it and it's not already papered, well, don't take this the wrong way but why bother? Unless you're looking for bragging rights about where the dog came from it's useless.

I am plan on training the dog to be a field dog i.e. upland birds, but I am really not into field trails and such. I don't care if my dog is famous as long as he does what I train him to do I will be very happy. Somebody told me that if the parents aren't papered and are not trained to hunt than you may have a problem getting the dog to hunt and may have health issues being that they are not certified. My family has had many dogs throughout my life and some great hunters and none of them have ever been papered.

So my second question would be, if the parents have not been trained to hunt but the grand parents were hunters should I worry that my dog won't hunt?

Thanks Again,

 

If you own a Pointer like some of us here do, then it might be worth it just to convince people who think they are GSP's that they are in fact not.

:lol::lol::lol:
Michigan's a GSP state and very, very few people have ever seen a pointer so if it loosely looks like a GSP it is!

So my second question would be, if the parents have not been trained to hunt but the grand parents were hunters should I worry that my dog won't hunt?
Thanks Again,

In a dog with a hunting ancestory, I think it's going to be tough to find one that won't hunt at all. The question is to what degree and how much training is required to get there? Proven, pedigreed parents help to remove that guesswork.

 

I am plan on training the dog to be a field dog i.e. upland birds, but I am really not into field trails and such. I don't care if my dog is famous as long as he does what I train him to do I will be very happy. Somebody told me that if the parents aren't papered and are not trained to hunt than you may have a problem getting the dog to hunt and may have health issues being that they are not certified. My family has had many dogs throughout my life and some great hunters and none of them have ever been papered.

So my second question would be, if the parents have not been trained to hunt but the grand parents were hunters should I worry that my dog won't hunt?

Thanks Again,

All a papered dog will get you is some relative assurance it can hunt and be clear of genetic disease. It's not a guarantee, just better odds.

:lol::lol::lol:
Michigan's a GSP state and very, very few people have ever seen a pointer so if it loosely looks like a GSP it is!

Had a guy the other day look at me skeptically when I told him mine was a Pointer. He told me he had seen Pointers colored with black and white, lemon and white, and orange and white but never liver and white. And yes, he asked if he was just a small GSP. Whatever. :rant:

 

Since your looking for an upland labrador it would be in your best interest to find out the background of your future hunting buddy as labs come in all shapes and sizes and in todays market generally are bred for things other then hunting such as pets, conformation and chinese soup.
Since labradors are the most common of back yard breeders things that would raise a red flag would be lack of health clearences on parents, parents bieng younger then 2, and lack of any papers. Lack of anyone of these and I personally would steer away.How old are the parents? health checks?
Do the owners of the parents hunt? What- waterfowl or upland?
Your investment gathering from your other posts is going to be a meanifull one it is important as you are talking about the next 10 or 12 years, rolling the dice is a large gamble.

 

Since you have to dog already train him and enjoy. Get him on some birds- he might hunt or he might not. He might turn out to be the best bird hunting machine that you have ever seen??!!

As Natty said if parents aren't papered then he can't be.

Keep us in the loop. Dont be afraid to ask training questions along the way!

 

As Natty said if parents aren't papered then he can't be.

Except UKC?

 

AKC and UKC you can register limited.-- But you need certification of spay/neuter, and a photo.

I have a mongrel that is showing great promise as a flusher.......

 

Since your looking for an upland labrador it would be in your best interest to find out the background of your future hunting buddy as labs come in all shapes and sizes and in todays market generally are bred for things other then hunting such as pets, conformation and chinese soup.
Since labradors are the most common of back yard breeders things that would raise a red flag would be lack of health clearences on parents, parents bieng younger then 2, and lack of any papers. Lack of anyone of these and I personally would steer away.How old are the parents? health checks?
Do the owners of the parents hunt? What- waterfowl or upland?
Your investment gathering from your other posts is going to be a meanifull one it is important as you are talking about the next 10 or 12 years, rolling the dice is a large gamble.

I second this, but at the same time you can get a great dog out of the classifieds of a local paper. With breeding done towards hunting and with health clearances you up your chances of having a hunting dog with good health. Labs once again are the number one dog in the nation and there are just tons of types of labs out there. I know someone that have labs that come show stock and they're great dogs, but they won't fetch a single thing.

If you already have the dog do like NEM and train him or her and enjoy the time you have.

 

Since you have to dog already train him and enjoy. Get him on some birds- he might hunt or he might not. He might turn out to be the best bird hunting machine that you have ever seen??!!

As Natty said if parents aren't papered then he can't be.

Keep us in the loop. Dont be afraid to ask training questions along the way!

Thanks NEM and everybody else for there comments, I will be talking the breeder tonight and maybe I can clarify the bloodline of the parents; also to confirm if the parents are or are not papered.

 

My M-I-L bought a maltese (sp) that was supposed to be a pure blood which im sure it is but didnt have any papers.
Not a big deal til the dog jumps down off the couch (about 1 foot high) and snaps her leg and they have to take to emergency vet and put her in a cast and what not. Dr said from looking at x-rays it was just a matter of time before dog did this because the leg was just not quiet right from birth and what not and was all in the genes. $1000.00 later and no papers on dog means she cant go after the breeder for selling her a dog that had known problems.
Sure papered dogs do just cost a lot more and more times than not dont have problems but that paper IMO is just that little bit more of a guentee that nothing is wrong with the dog..

 

How important is it to have your dog papered? I plan on getting him fixed and I never plan on showing him in any field trials. So are there any other reason why I should have my dog papered. He does come from a pure bread back ground but neither parents are papered. Just thought I would send this question to you guys or gals.

Thanks Again for your input,

fulldraw

I have spoken with those who never plan to run in a hunt test but later change their mind just for the fun of it.

 

Sure papered dogs do just cost a lot more and more times than not dont have problems but that paper IMO is just that little bit more of a guentee that nothing is wrong with the dog..

AKC/UKC papers don't really give you any guarantee that the dog will be healthy. A good breeder that makes sure both the Sire and Dam have had all the health tests done don't give you an absolute guarantee either. But the testing does increase your chances of having a healthy pup. Considering the time and emotional and monetary investment made when bringing a pup home, I would highly recomend buying from a litter that has had both parents tested.

I know there are lots of healthy dogs born to backyard pairings without the testing. But I know I want to go as far as I can to make sure my new hunting buddy is healthy.

My 2 cents.

Remnar

 

As I mentioned early, I spoke to the breeder again tonight. The pups are doing great growing more everyday and there eyes are almost open. The mother is doing fine as was checked out by the vet after the birth as she is doing great. The pups will be going to the vet soon to be checked over and before I pick the pup up in just over a month they will be cleared by the vet, have there first shots, and be wormed. The breeder is an excellent person who loves her dogs, the main reason why she did not get the pups papered was do to the economy that we are in. She just didn't think that people would pay $600-$900 for a puppy with this economy.

Thanks again for all your concerns and comments, I read each one of your comments and take time think about what everybody is saying.

 

The litter registration is only twenty dollars for FDSB. It doesn't require anyone to sell them for a much higher price than non registered pups unless they want to.

 

The litter registration is only twenty dollars for FDSB. It doesn't require anyone to sell them for a much higher price than non registered pups unless they want to.

FDSB is for those who want to confirm that the dog you are getting from the correct male and female that the breeder says it is from and that it is a pure bred. It also makes it so that the litter points count in the record books for field trails and so that the dog can be bred later on in life.

As I have mentioned previously I will be getting the dog fixed and that I don't plan on doing field trials.

If anybody doesn't know what FDSB as I did I had to look it up see below:



Field Dog Stud Book Policy, Procedure and Penalty
when DNA Testing Shows a Dog to be of Misrepresented Breeding

The registration of pure-bred dogs — for more than 100 years — has been based on the veracity of the breeders (owners of the sire and the dam) and the accuracy of the information submitted on the breeding certificates attesting to the breeding.

Modern technology — DNA — has now provided an affordable, reliable and easy method for owners and prospective owners to verify the authenticity of the breeding of pure-bred dogs.

When the results of DNA show that a dog is not by a specific sire (or from specific dam), that misrepresentation of the dog’s breeding — intentional or unintentional — in effect renders that dog’s registration in the records of the Field Dog Stud Book null and void. The dog, in effect, because of the misrepresentation in its breeding, is unregistered and, as unregistered, unable to earn credit for placements or to be used at stud or to produce registrable litters.

When a dog, by DNA testing, is found to be of misrepresented breeding — either the sire, or dam of both — that dog’s Field Dog Stud Book (FDSB) records (the individual registration of the dog, the litter from which that dog emanated, and the win record of the tested dog) shall be suspended.

The records of all dogs shown as being littermates to the tested dog, and their win records, shall also be suspended. All litters possibly produced by the tested dog or his or her littermates shall also be suspended. This suspension shall remain in effect until such time as DNA (both sire and dam) shall verify the correct breeding.

The owner(s) of the tested dog shall immediately be notified of the misrepresentation, and the handler, if he or she is the person who submitted the DNA sample, shall also be notified of the misrepresentation.

The owner(s) of the dam and the owner(s) of the stud dog shown on the litter enrollment application shall immediately be notified of the misrepresentation.

When and if the breeding is rectified (through DNA), the litter then becomes eligible for enrollment and individual dogs from the litter for registration.

Those individuals who signed breeders certificates (stud and dam) certifying the breeding of a specific sire to a specific bitch, or any other individual party to a misrepresentation of a registration, are the responsible parties and they shall share equally the costs incurred by the FDSB related to the work of placing a “hold” on the respective FDSB records.

Costs shall be determined at the time.

Failure of the responsible parties — owner(s) of the stud dog and owner(s) or lessee of the dam, or any other individual(s) found to be party to the misrepresentation — to pay in full the fees charged by the FDSB shall forfeit their right to avail themselves of FDSB services (litter enrollment, registration of individual dogs, transfer of ownership, and the recording of recognized field trial placements) and any other related services offered by the American Field Publishing Company. Non payment of fees shall also affect the eligibility of dogs from misrepresented litters to be registered when DNA has confirmed their correct breeding.

Responsible parties — owner(s) of the stud dog or owner(s) of the bitch, or any other persons submitting false registration applications — found by DNA testing to have misrepresented the breeding of a second litter or an individual dog shall be denied Field Dog Stud Book services permanently.

The Field Dog Stud Book requires all pointing dogs that win championship placements (winner and runner-up), open and amateur, to submit DNA to the FDSB for testing within 30 days of the win. Failure to comply with this requirement shall result in those dogs’ records being suspended until this requirement is met.