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Discussion Starter #1
While the crossbow issue has not quite been resolved yet, The dam has been broken.

Thank you to all who got involved,You know who you are. Especially those who invested the time and money to travel to Lansing several times. We would not be to this point without the efforts of the fine people at Michigan-Sportsman.

Rep. Sheltrown and Brady.....Once again you have taken action on behalf of the sportsmen of Michigan. Thank you for your continuing dedication to expand and preserve outdoor recreational opportunities in this state, You guys ROCK !

To the anti crossbow side.....While many of you may not believe it, This has been a pure grassroots effort from the begining. It NEVER had anything to do with the industry. Just a bunch of people whith an idea who organized and got it done.

It can be done, That has now been proven. And it can be done again if the desire and cooperation is there.
 

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Swampbuck,

Thank you for the public thank you. But, honestly, we don't deserve the thanks until we can ensure that hunters in northern Michigan aren't being discriminated against.
 

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Discussion Starter #3 (Edited)
Swampbuck,

Thank you for the public thank you. But, honestly, we don't deserve the thanks until we can ensure that hunters in northern Michigan aren't being discriminated against.
I have no doubt that you guys will do everything possible to make that happen.

I went back and looked at your first post here seeking input on hb5741.
Sure was some entertaining reading. The ball started rolling almost a year ago 3-31-08. Well maybe a little before that, But that certainly was the turning point.

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=229424

Now that you guys are warmed up with crossbows, atvs etc. maybe you could finish that little road-end issue....LOL
 

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To the anti crossbow side.....While many of you may not believe it, This has been a pure grassroots effort from the begining. It NEVER had anything to do with the industry. Just a bunch of people whith an idea who organized and got it done.

It can be done, That has now been proven. And it can be done again if the desire and cooperation is there.
So your telling us that no crossbow manufactures or any other company that would benifit from this financially had absoultly anything do with it, correct ?

Just a bunch of concerned Michigan Sportspeople ?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
So your telling us that no crossbow manufactures or any other company that would benifit from this financially had absoultly anything do with it, correct ?




Just a bunch of concerned Michigan Sportspeople ?
1-There may have been some after it was well on the way, I dont know all the fine details. But ceratainly not in the begining or in any major way.

2-yup, thats pretty much it.:) I think thats been stated here many times, you may have missed it though.
 

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A lot of ordinary folks that want to do something they love--bowhunt; why is that so hard to believe?:idea:
 

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To Joel, Brady, and all the others who put 'the people, opportunity in the outdoors, and fairness' at the head of the list.
~m~
 

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Swampbuck, when this first started it was about three elderly men at a church in West Branch who could not hunt with a vertical bow anymore yet couldn't get a crossbow permit. Today, I get to work and my inbox is full of contacts over the weekend from people pushing ideas like the repeal of Proposal G and the end of the NRC (which Sheltrown is not advocating, btw). Apparently this issue was a bit bigger than we originally anticipated.

The one party that is nearly invisible in the process and is never mentioned are the wildlife management professionals in other states we've had contact with. When Sheltrown introduced the bill to provide crossbows to those 69 and older, we contacted other state's conservation departments to get their take on age limits for crossbows. Rountinely we were asked, "Why not just go with full inclusion?" We didn't have a logical answer to that question. After searching, I found out that no one else did either.

What's interesting to watch is how these calls to other state's DNRs have initiated conversations regarding crossbows between those states. As a result, the trickle of legislation and rules liberalizing crossbow restrictions across the country over the past decade has turned into a flood over the past year. Even though Michigan has yet to eliminate its ban outright like Ohio, Pennsylvania, North Carolina, Texas, etc., I like to think that those three old-timers in Ogemaw County had an unintended hand in providing greater recreational opportunity to millions of hunters across the country.
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Send a big thanks to all of them also.:D.......... I sent Rep Sheltrown and e-mail right after he introduced the original 5741 suggesting full inclusion instead, Whichever one of you replied mentioned those gentleman, At that time he was MUCH less enthusiastic about full inclusion. I hope they are aware of the positive effect they have had on so many sportsmen.
 

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While the crossbow issue has not quite been resolved yet, The dam has been broken.

Thank you to all who got involved,You know who you are. Especially those who invested the time and money to travel to Lansing several times. We would not be to this point without the efforts of the fine people at Michigan-Sportsman.

Rep. Sheltrown and Brady.....Once again you have taken action on behalf of the sportsmen of Michigan. Thank you for your continuing dedication to expand and preserve outdoor recreational opportunities in this state, You guys ROCK !

To the anti crossbow side.....While many of you may not believe it, This has been a pure grassroots effort from the begining. It NEVER had anything to do with the industry. Just a bunch of people whith an idea who organized and got it done.

It can be done, That has now been proven. And it can be done again if the desire and cooperation is there.
Now if we can just get them to change the way they manage the deer herd.

To the anti QDM side........While many of you may not believe it, it will have nothing to do with antlers. Just a bunch of hunters who want to see better deer and better deer hunting.
 

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For all those involved a warm and deepest "thank you" from my son and I. I don't thank this is enough but a big "thanks". You did a lot of sportsmen good!
Pat
 

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Trust me, there are a lot of people out there who have helped with this issue. The vast majority of them will go unnamed.

As for the of the crossbow industry's involvement I for one have stated many times on these boards that TenPointe Archery has been involved. Chuck Jordan of TenPointe testified last June at a hearing of Rep. Sheltrown's committee. Of course other crossbow manufacturers have expressed interest in the issue and this has been stated by me, at least, in these forums.

This "red herring" has been tossed out many times over the past year and the response from me has been the same. Not everyone is knowledgable of everything that's gone on in the past year so they may not know of a particular point. That's no fault of there's in anyway.

Keep in mind that Fred Bear, a longbow industry guy of some noteriety, along with two other bow industry archers from Wisconsin........I cannot remember their names.....were at the forefront of MI's and WI's first bow season back in the '30s.

Tom Jennings and other compound bow manufacturers were very active in various states in the early '70s with the advent of the compound bow. The question is, "So what?"

The basic root of this latest effort, and I've been involved since writing an article that was published in Woods n' Waters News in Sept.....I think it was Sept....of '07, or the most part, has been your average sportsmen and women who were either interested in using a crossbow or saw the fact that crossbow inclusion would have no detrimental effect on the deer herd, and other, similar reasons.
 

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Detrimental effect? That has yet to be seen. I think SLP public land hunters may have a different opinion come Oct. 1. Lets also not forget the issue of private hunting land access in the SLP, it just got even tougher.

Great job.
 

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Detrimental effect? That has yet to be seen. I think SLP public land hunters may have a different opinion come Oct. 1. Lets also not forget the issue of private hunting land access in the SLP, it just got even tougher.

Great job.
You know, it's all in the eye of the beholder, Buck Bed.

1. The MI DNR has stated that the use of crossbows will not have a negative effect on wildlife populations. Just to be sure, The NRC has placed a 3-year sunset on the entire program, in case things go to hell in a hand-basket, like some fear (I am not in that company, thank you).

2. Public land in the SLP makes up about 6% of the available hunting land. If encroachment from other hunters gives you the jitters, you might consider the advice of the late comedian Sam Kinison when taking about the people that lived in the African desert and never had any food. He told them to MOVE! Case-in-point...Zones 1 and 2 just became the mecca for non-crossbow hunters (trad, compounds). Think about it. The only xbow folks you'll see in zones 1 and 2 will be cripples and fossils. And the fossils will only be around until November 14!

3. And, as far as private land in zone 3, I would have to think that landowners are suddenly filled with absolute glee by the fact that crossbows are only allowed on land down here, versus the zones north of there. I spoke to a realtor yesterday and he said land values in prime recreational properties in Zone 3 have shot up 50-75% since last Thursday. In fact, he was going to start a marketing campaign exploiting the situation. It's called "Say ya to the SLP". Has a ring to it, don't ya think?

Yeah, we all know the NRC made a big mistake when they didn't approve full inclusion in all three zones, particularly after what the DNR said about there being no negative effect, etc. It's almost like they ignored Proposal G :yikes:. Well, I, for one, aint bitch'n. Hunting land in my neck of the woods just went up $1,200 per-acre! Frankly, I don't know if we should be kissing or cursing the NRC for their decision last week. The folks in zone #3 are prolly happy as pigs in poop. Not exactly sure the feeling of the folks up north.
Anyway, I do like that jingle; "Say ya to the SLP".;)

Riva
(zone 3)
 

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The folks in zone #3 are prolly happy as pigs in poop. Not exactly sure the feeling of the folks up north.
Anyway, I do like that jingle; "Say ya to the SLP".;)

Riva
(zone 3)
Let me tell you so you're sure how we feel up here...

DMU 452 is above herd goal numbers, DNR wants them shot.

Makes no sense why there are any restrictions where I hunt.

Instead of having a choice of bow or crossbow in October, I'll just have to smack some doe's in the early rifle season in Sept.

Thanks NRC, idiots...
 

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You know, it's all in the eye of the beholder, Buck Bed.

1. The MI DNR has stated that the use of crossbows will not have a negative effect on wildlife populations. Just to be sure, The NRC has placed a 3-year sunset on the entire program, just to make sure that things don't go to hell in a hand-basket, like some fear (I am not in that company, thank you).

2. Public land in the SLP makes up about 6% of the available hunting land. If encroachment from other hunters gives you the jitters, you might consider the advice of the late comedian Sam Kinison when taking about the people that lived in the African desert and never had any food. He told them to MOVE! Case-in-point...Zones 2 and 3 just became the mecca for non-crossbow hunters (trad, compounds). Think about it. The only xbow folks you'll see in zones 2 and 3 will be cripples and fossils. And the fossils will only be around until November 14!
Although many holocaust deniers continue to pretend otherwise, fact is that Kinison was decidedly full inclusion. I found the testimony of Kinison's fifth wife to be particularly compelling at last week's meeting - brought more than one tear to my eye, I'm not ashamed to admit. Combine that fact with the wildlife divisions statement of support and you have quite a 1-2 combination for the anti crossbow crowd to overcome.
 
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