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Chicken Little (bent) is nothing but does like making up ridiculous excuses trying to cover up his stories and knows very little about anything. Chump you are not worth anyone one on this site listening to you. I don’t believe you and it’s obvious that very few others believe you either. Nobody believes you can't identify yourself or what you did as a job or what you do now. Since honesty and truthfulness isn't you best part, bit of advice to you, don’t go away mad, just go away.
 

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I was told by folks in the courthouse that the DNR seemed to have a bad day and that is what I reported.
Which "folks"?? How did you know these people? Why did you know these people? Were they in the courthouse for other crimes or were they there because they were canned pen owners?

 

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I was awarded a settlement but only after I signed a document saying I could never discuss my case in any way shape or form in public. I was paid by the taxpayers in Michigan to keep quiet about how badly the DNR screwed up.
You just violated your terms of the settlement. Hopefully the moderators pass along your email and alert the proper authorities.

A 37 year old construction worker from Marne who's a sports coach shouldn't be too hard to figure out. Unless of course, you're lying in your profile.
 

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Chicken Little (bent) is nothing but does like making up ridiculous excuses trying to cover up his stories and knows very little about anything. Chump you are not worth anyone one on this site listening to you. I don’t believe you and it’s obvious that very few others believe you either. Nobody believes you can't identify yourself or what you did as a job or what you do now. Since honesty and truthfulness isn't you best part, bit of advice to you, don’t go away mad, just go away.
BORE,

Based on the number of PM's I get whenever you start blathering on in defense of the DNR "Everybody Loves Raymond" apparently does not apply to you. What have you done over the years to piss so many people off and why are they so interested in what you are really like???

Maybe all the HGH you have been injecting in your ass over the years has finally taken its toll :lol: Chump..don't go away mad just go away is pretty tough talk for an ex-security guard on steroids. Sticks and stones Ray..sticks and stones :lol::lol:
 

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Discussion Starter #325 (Edited)
You just violated your terms of the settlement. Hopefully the moderators pass along your email and alert the proper authorities.

A 37 year old construction worker from Marne who's a sports coach shouldn't be too hard to figure out. Unless of course, you're lying in your profile.
Damn...tripped up by the other genius. :lol: :hide: :lol:
 

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Discussion Starter #326 (Edited)
Ahhhh...sounds like an embittered pen owner. You sure do talk a lot for someone who is not supposed to be talking:lol:.

If the Michigan DNR is evil for outlawing wild pigs in "hunting" enclosures, so are the Indiana and Wisconsin DNRs. All of them are politically motivated and none of them are really thinking about their natural resources, right? They are just making all this stuff up to get you.:lol:

I wonder under what circumstances your ranting here might be discoverable by the evil doers at the DNR?:lol:

http://lawvibe.com/identifying-anonymous-forum-posters-is-a-real-possibility/
I can talk, just not about my settlement...

You hate enclosures and want them shut down. Got it! Since attacking pigs are the real issue, I can loan you my anti-pig whistle that only pigs can hear. You blow it three times and they run towards water and drown themselves. Al Gore invented it....$10 each on e-bay...great stocking stuffer for your neighbors. I bagged three piggies last week with nine tweets from the whistle. One was a booner, the other two were 1 1/2 year old piglets.
 

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by the way OP, I'm not defending the DNR, I'm defending the feral swine control issue.....I have this thing against invasives......:evilsmile

in addition, if you dont know Anything about what I was talking about, we have a WHOLE section here on the forum about feral swine....might wanna take a look.:evilsmile
 

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BORE,

Based on the number of PM's I get whenever you start blathering on in defense of the DNR "Everybody Loves Raymond" apparently does not apply to you. What have you done over the years to piss so many people off and why are they so interested in what you are really like???

Maybe all the HGH you have been injecting in your ass over the years has finally taken its toll :lol: Chump..don't go away mad just go away is pretty tough talk for an ex-security guard on steroids. Sticks and stones Ray..sticks and stones :lol::lol:
I apologize since I can't understand being as stupid as you are and that is the best you can do, just like I said ridiculous excuses by chicken little.:lol::lol::lol:
 

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Discussion Starter #329 (Edited)
:yikes:
by the way OP, I'm not defending the DNR, I'm defending the feral swine control issue.....I have this thing against invasives......:evilsmile

in addition, if you dont know Anything about what I was talking about, we have a WHOLE section here on the forum about feral swine....might wanna take a look.:evilsmile
I know a lot about pigs and feral pigs. A feral hog is pig that looks a little rough after being outside the barnyard for an extended period of time...unclean, unshave, like the hunters during the second week of deer camp.I don't know you or what you know but I will give you a nudge as to what is happening.

We have a new govenor who by his own admission knows very little about the DNR and what they do. You have a new DNR Director, who, although a lifelong bureaucrat, has very little practical experience from a wildlife standpoint within the DNR. He is simply a non hunting, non fishing pencil pusher buiding up his retirement denominator for a couple more years while being led around like a hog with a nose ring.

Enter Wildlife Chief, Russ Mason who has never been shy about his wanting to shut down ALL high fence operations in Michigan. Last but not least you have Russ's buddy, former MUCC director and current Chief of staff for the Govenor, Dennis Muchmore, acting as the puppeteer in all of this. It's the perfect storm for jamming executive orders through at this point out of complete arrogance on one hand, ignorance on the other and largely unchallenged up until this point. Muchmore is a non hunting, card carrying member of the Capital Humane Society, and has apposed high fenced hunts along with MUCC.

The problem is those pesky private property rights have kept this scheme from fully developing and out of complete desperation they decided to throw the ISO on the table and hang their hat on that. The courts will decide who is right but you are clearly on record here supporting the DNR's position which you have every right to. I not only disagree with you but am pissed about the process in which they are proceeding...total disregard for due process and honesty which is why I want to see them get crushed on this issue, :SHOCKED:
 

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:yikes:

I know a lot about pigs and feral pigs. A feral hog is pig that looks a little rough after being outside the barnyard for an extended period of time...unclean, unshave, like a the hunters during the second week of deer camp.

I don't know you or what you know but I will give you a nudge as to what is happening.

We have a new govenor who by his own admission knows very little about the DNR and what they do. You have a new DNR Director, who, although a lifelong bureaucrat, has very little practical experience from a wildlife standpoint within the DNR. He is simply a non hunting, non fishing pencil pusher buiding up his retirement denominator while being led around like a hog with a nose ring.

Enter Wildlife Chief, Russ Mason who has never been shy about his wanting to shut down ALL high fence operations in Michigan. Last but not least you have Russ's buddy, former MUCC director and current Chief of staff for the Govenor, Dennis Muchmore, acting as the puppeteer in all of this. It's the perfect storm for jamming executive orders through at this point out of complete arrogance on one hand, ignorance on the other and largely unchallenged up until this point. Muchmore is a card carrying member of the Humane Society, and has apposed high fenced hunts allong with MUCC.

The problem is those pesky private property rights have kept this scheme from fully developing and out of complete desperation they decided to throw the ISO on the table and hang their hat on that. The courts will decide who is right but you are clearly on record here supporting the DNR's position which you have every right to. I not only disagree with you but am pissed about the process in which they are proceeding...total disregard for due process and honesty which is why I want to see them get crushed on this issue, :SHOCKED:
I am aware of the people you mentioned being in such positions. Thanks for stating your want for a court case to move in your apparent favor.
What I've been trying to say is there are MANY more operators involved in the feral swine issue....whatever you think an a gov. depts. motive is is fine, you have a right to your opinion.
Would such ruling help or harm feral swine control in MI??? I guess we'll see huh.
Other states see and have seen the idea of "turning off the faucet" or "fixing a leak" as a form of not allowing additional animals to contribute to a growing problem. Why wouldn't MI want to follow suit........makes sense to me.
Kristie
(with that, I'll leave you to your bashing, I was trying in this thread, to examine the issue behind your OP)
:evilsmile
 

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There isn_ any reason to plug one hole of a sieve when the rest remain unchecked. Plug them all if you're going to follow that route. Unfortunately we all know that going against the farm bureau and pork producers in an effort to do such a thing would be political suicide. So instead they look for a scapegoat that won't cost them as much politically or financially. And of course there are clearly better ways to fix a leak other than shutting down businesses.
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Discussion Starter #332 (Edited)
There isn_ any reason to plug one hole of a sieve when the rest remain unchecked. Plug them all if you're going to follow that route. Unfortunately we all know that going against the farm bureau and pork producers in an effort to do such a thing would be political suicide. So instead they look for a scapegoat that won't cost them as much politically or financially. And of course there are clearly better ways to fix a leak other than shutting down businesses.
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Remember the Department of Ag handles all pork producing operations except for the high fence ones we are discussing here. The DNR does not want to deal with these guys...they feel it is benieth them and apparently will do or say anything to shut them down. The ISO absolutely proves what a joke this all is and how desperate the DNR has become to avoid the work assigned to them. The next step will be eliminating deer operations which include MI lure manufactureres etc.

The DNR does not want to spend money enforcing high fence opertaions when they could be using that money on their rapidly increasing legacy costs. That is all this is about. If you want to hear the scary pig stories go away...turn the oversight back over to the Department of Ag and let the Wildlife guys go back to whatever it is they were doing before getting stuck on Jurrasic Pork duty. . :dizzy:
 

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One wonders if the April 1st deadline is not overturned, how many captive swine that are currently behind a fence will be "liberated" on March 31st?

It would be sadly ironic if this move by the DNR was the genesis for hundreds of swine being released from captivity in Michigan. :yikes:
 

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Discussion Starter #334
The Manistee Advocate

Monday February 27, 2012

http://news.pioneergroup.com/manist...swine-farmers-because-of-how-their-pigs-look/

DNR order threatens heritage swine farmers because of how their pigs look

By DARWIN L. BOOHER
State Senator – 35th District

When Mark Baker retired from the Air Force after protecting our nation for 20 years, he never thought he would be fighting his own state government to protect his family’s livelihood. Unfortunately, that’s what is happening now.

Four years ago, Mark, his wife and six children began raising Mangalitsa and Russian swine at Baker’s Green Acres farm. The breeds are two of the many types of heritage hogs and there is a tremendous market for niche animals like these pigs for small farm operations.

However, Mark and other farmers that raise heritage swine are being told by the Michigan Department of Natural Resources (DNR) that they must get rid of them by April 1.

In December 2010, the Michigan DNR issued an invasive species order (ISO) to make certain types of swine an invasive species, which prohibits farmers from raising them on their farms. The order became effective on Oct. 8, 2011 and affects all heritage hogs in Michigan . Even potbellied pigs, which are often raised as pets, may now be considered an invasive species in Michigan .

It’s ironic that just a week after the ISO’s effective date Traverse City hosted Pigstock, a four-day course about Michigan Mangalitsa pigs. The course taught about breeding and husbandry practices, methods of processing and charcuterie. Chefs from throughout the Midwest attended the conference. Now, the DNR’s order jeopardizes not only this conference, but the economic opportunities for small farm operations that raise heritage pigs.

The DNR’s thinking is irrational. The department says we must ban certain pigs because the state has a feral hog problem (pigs running at-large or outside a fence). But since all pigs outside of a fence are feral and the DNR cannot genetically differentiate between swine, the department decided to ban certain pigs in Michigan simply due to their appearance.

In December 2012, the DNR issued a ruling describing the characteristics that pigs cannot have or they will be considered an invasive species. Hence the Mangalista, along with many other breeds of swine that look different, are now considered invasive.

The politics of all of this – let’s call it pig politics – has been nothing less than amazing.

The small farmers I have talked to wonder why the DNR is singling out their pigs and is joining forces with the Michigan Pork Producers Association on this issue. They believe the association wants all pigs to be raised in confinement facilities, and the best way to achieve that is to make it illegal to raise certain swine, especially those offering alternatives to the white pork raised in confinement.

In a Nov. 2, 2010 Traverse City Record-Eagle story, Agriculture Commissioner Don Coe said the Mangalitsa pigs can be grown locally, “not in large feedlots, but humanely, on small farms, the way they used to be.”

I believe it was a mistake for the DNR to involve itself in an agricultural issue that is not associated whatsoever with its mission. The DNR is charged with management of game and wildlife owned by the public – not the regulation of privately-owned animals. That is the responsibility of the Michigan Department of Agriculture and Rural Development.

My legislative colleagues and I have repeatedly asked the DNR to revise the ISO so it will not apply to pigs that are raised by people. We specifically asked DNR Director Rodney Stokes to rescind the order or revise it to apply only to pigs running wild outside a fence. Governor Snyder could also require it to be changed. Unfortunately neither has taken action.

This is a perfect example of government and bureaucrats moving their own agendas forward with total disregard for the law, private property rights and the Constitution.

Most importantly, it leaves Mark Baker – a man who has served our country honorably – little choice but to take action on his own to protect his family’s way of life from an overzealous state department. Beyond Mark, there are farmers all across Michigan that the DNR dictates must depopulate their animals because they are invasive species simply based on looks.

I oppose the DNR’s actions and will continue to stand up against this state government overreach.

I encourage you to contact Governor Snyder and DNR Director Stokes to express your opposition to this type of government behavior. Ask them to rescind this order and stand up for the small businesses that are providing choice in Michigan ’s food industry.
 

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The Manistee Advocate



By DARWIN L. BOOHER
State Senator – 35th District

When Mark Baker retired from the Air Force after protecting our nation for 20 years, he never thought he would be fighting his own state government to protect his family’s livelihood. Unfortunately, that’s what is happening now.
Mark is not alone. In near 30 years of Law Enforcement, the last thing I would have imagined is that my own Government would LIE to Me. Perhaps I am naive, or just refused to see it in front of my face, I dont know. I do know that early in life, it was hard to catch a corrupt public official but they were dealt with when they were caught.

Lately the line I'm hearing all too often is...

"Let's move on and forget".... The latest version from previous public statements of Michigan Government and their minions..."Forget the past, let's move Michigan forward"...."Now is not the time to point fingers, let's learn from this and move on"..

To those I say...Dont hold your breath.
 

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The small farmers I have talked to wonder why the DNR is singling out their pigs and is joining forces with the Michigan Pork Producers Association on this issue. They believe the association wants all pigs to be raised in confinement facilities, and the best way to achieve that is to make it illegal to raise certain swine, especially those offering alternatives to the white pork raised in confinement.
These statement are false. I'm suprised Darwin would write this...

The Michigan Pork Producers Association does alot to support operations that are not confinement farms. If you want evidence of this, check out your local county fair. If you think the majority of pigs shown there are raised in a confinement barn, you are mistaken.
 

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http://michigan.gov/dnr/0,4570,7-153--272312--,00.html

[SIZE=+1]Joint Undercover Wildlife Investigation in Colorado, Michigan, Yields Four Arrests, Multiple Charges[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Contact: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Det. Lt. Jason Haines, (989) 839-4711 or Ed Golder, 517-335-3014 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Agency:[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Natural Resources[/SIZE]


[SIZE=-1]Feb. 28, 2012
[/SIZE]

...........
The three Prescott men are Jerome Thorson, 64, and his sons, Ole Thorson, 35, and Travis Thorson, 40. The Thorsons were arraigned Thursday, Feb. 16 at 82nd District Court in Ogemaw County. Todd Osier, 41, of Standish was arraigned Thursday, Feb. 23 in Ogemaw County District Court on a single count of cruelty to animals.

The investigation was conducted by the Michigan DNR's Special Investigations Unit (SIU) and Colorado Parks and Wildlife Law Enforcement Unit.

Jerome Thorson faces 23 separate counts on charges that include importation of illegally taken game from another state; capturing whitetail deer from the wild; building and maintaining an illegal deer enclosure without a permit; illegal taking of otter, bobcat and mink; illegal trapping; possession of an illegal silencer; and animal cruelty to horses. Ole Thorson has been charged with importing elk illegally taken in another state and possession of an illegally taken pine marten. Travis Thorson faces one count of cruelty to animals............

DO WE HONESTLY BELIEVE THAT DRIVING LEGAL ENCLOSED HUNTING FACILITIES, OR FARMS WITH UGLY PIGS OUT OF MICHIGAN WILL HAVE ANY IMPACT OR SATISFY DNR's CONCERNS ABOUT INVASIVES OR THE SPREAD OF DISEASE?

Last night there was a town hall in Port Huron..many there pissed off about poachers and poaching operations among other things. The latest buzzword is "co-ops"... Yeah, ok...

Our C.O.'s do a great job with a very limited resource, hats off to them! It's a rotten shame that politics and what I basically see as money laundering by the DNR management and Snyders right hand man that presents the spin about fiscal woes when appropriations has repeatedly awarded funding for boots on the ground....positions DNR repeatedly fails to fill in favor of desk drivers that have no clue outside of their text books and operations manuals no doubt written by bookworms with little real world insights as it applies to the out of doors.

Bent Duck, I dont know who you are...but the facts you've presented are spot on to everything I have heard and read outside of this website. I dont care who you are or your background, you've stated fact, others presented ambiguous opinions, questioning a motive or charachter, perhaps to re-direct.

Unfortunately it's all too often this tactic is employed...and resented by those of us who choose to operate within the parameters of the law and dont particularily appreciate more and more controls put on our every day lives with a blanket approach, such as the DNR's method of operation.

Please keep the updates coming as you learn them...youre obviously closer to the moves being made than the rest of us are. THANK YOU.
 

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http://michigan.gov/dnr/0,4570,7-153--272312--,00.html

[SIZE=+1]Joint Undercover Wildlife Investigation in Colorado, Michigan, Yields Four Arrests, Multiple Charges[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Contact: [/SIZE][SIZE=-1]Det. Lt. Jason Haines, (989) 839-4711 or Ed Golder, 517-335-3014 [/SIZE]
[SIZE=-1]Agency:[/SIZE] [SIZE=-1]Natural Resources[/SIZE]


[SIZE=-1]Feb. 28, 2012
[/SIZE]

...........
The three Prescott men are Jerome Thorson, 64, and his sons, Ole Thorson, 35, and Travis Thorson, 40. The Thorsons were arraigned Thursday, Feb. 16 at 82nd District Court in Ogemaw County. Todd Osier, 41, of Standish was arraigned Thursday, Feb. 23 in Ogemaw County District Court on a single count of cruelty to animals.

The investigation was conducted by the Michigan DNR's Special Investigations Unit (SIU) and Colorado Parks and Wildlife Law Enforcement Unit.

Jerome Thorson faces 23 separate counts on charges that include importation of illegally taken game from another state; capturing whitetail deer from the wild; building and maintaining an illegal deer enclosure without a permit; illegal taking of otter, bobcat and mink; illegal trapping; possession of an illegal silencer; and animal cruelty to horses. Ole Thorson has been charged with importing elk illegally taken in another state and possession of an illegally taken pine marten. Travis Thorson faces one count of cruelty to animals............

DO WE HONESTLY BELIEVE THAT DRIVING LEGAL ENCLOSED HUNTING FACILITIES, OR FARMS WITH UGLY PIGS OUT OF MICHIGAN WILL HAVE ANY IMPACT OR SATISFY DNR's CONCERNS ABOUT INVASIVES OR THE SPREAD OF DISEASE?

Last night there was a town hall in Port Huron..many there pissed off about poachers and poaching operations among other things. The latest buzzword is "co-ops"... Yeah, ok...

Our C.O.'s do a great job with a very limited resource, hats off to them! It's a rotten shame that politics and what I basically see as money laundering by the DNR management and Snyders right hand man that presents the spin about fiscal woes when appropriations has repeatedly awarded funding for boots on the ground....positions DNR repeatedly fails to fill in favor of desk drivers that have no clue outside of their text books and operations manuals no doubt written by bookworms with little real world insights as it applies to the out of doors.

Bent Duck, I dont know who you are...but the facts you've presented are spot on to everything I have heard and read outside of this website. I dont care who you are or your background, you've stated fact, others presented ambiguous opinions, questioning a motive or charachter, perhaps to re-direct.

Unfortunately it's all too often this tactic is employed...and resented by those of us who choose to operate within the parameters of the law and dont particularily appreciate more and more controls put on our every day lives with a blanket approach, such as the DNR's method of operation.

Please keep the updates coming as you learn them...youre obviously closer to the moves being made than the rest of us are. THANK YOU.
You have sealed your own fate here for supporting anything I say or post...:lol:

I don't have blind faith in any government program anymore...I used too, but that is all but gone. The truth of the matter is this state and our country are FUBAR and anything we do is probably too little too late. I refuse to go down though without trying to shed a little light on these issues, even those as relatively insignificant as this.

I seriously don't mind folks taking shots at me and in fact wear them like a badge of honor considering the source of some of these apologists. Sometimes you have to stir things up to get people to open their eyes...look how how many posts have contributed to this thread... that is a good thing. I think most here are well meaning, some just happen to be naiive or uninformed and that is something we have to live with and try to change one post at a time. They get one vote just like us. :yikes: Keep plugging away.
 

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Let me correct or add to one statement...

Others have also shared their REAL experiences, and I dont mean to imply theyve been disingenuous or misleading. NO DOUBT theyve experienced REAL problems with crop loss and worry.

I dont believe the solution to their woes is being addressed in a way that will achieve success.

The DNR is wrong with it's blanket approach, and it's a consistent method of operation. 10 atv's mowing down cat tails or making a mark in the sand dunes does not come close to suggesting there is a statewide problem that should be addressed by heavily restricting one of yet another recreational activities that generates mega bucks to Michigan's economy.

The other mindscrew in place is the moral sheeple herding tactic of the goody two shoes ramping up on raising permit fees and license fees...they want to jack up hunting and fishing license fees drinking the koolaid that Wildlife Division is broke..I content it's by choice.

They want to raise atv permits just like they did snowmobiles to 45.00 per year. And of course the calls for volunteers to do their field work, nobody wants to bother with....picking up trash, brushing and invasive plant removals and a host of other "feel good about yourself now youre somebody" programs....all the while staying the course of tapping the scam for all they can get...

Stokes padding his retirement spot on in my view. He was going to leave, and in my opinion we cant take muchmore!

IF the courts rule against the DNR it's yet another "tic" on the losing side for them. They do very well with criminal investigations, but their agenda driven actions, the DEQ B.S. on landowners, or the knit picking crap theyre notoriously rumored to pull, they are losing or withdrawing charges a lot. This stuff is kept off the radar....if the masses knew I contend there would be some major changes demanded and made.

Probably reduce the disgruntled departures from DNR as well.

HOPEFULLY the MSAPAC will change things for the better.
 

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These statement are false. I'm suprised Darwin would write this...

The Michigan Pork Producers Association does alot to support operations that are not confinement farms. If you want evidence of this, check out your local county fair. If you think the majority of pigs shown there are raised in a confinement barn, you are mistaken.
What is happening here is that the opinion of one individual who chooses to raise an exotic form of pig is being stated. That's fine. Funny thing is, nobody is keeping that individual from raising pigs. He can raise domestic pigs without anyone affecting his lifestyle.

The Michigan Pork Producers, whose role is to support not just one individual's point of view, but to reflect the desire of an entire half billion dollar industry, support the DNR's actions regarding exotic pigs. See page 3 here: http://www.mipork.org/Portals/mipork/Issue2.pdf

Page 9: http://www.mipork.org/Portals/mipork/Issue3.pdf

http://www.miwaterstewardship.org/m...s-turn-out-in-support-of-invasive-species-ban

http://www.wilx.com/news/headlines/Banning_Feral_Pigs_123852214.html
 
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