I've always heard good things about their customer service. That's too bad they're screwing you over. I would have to say though, that you get what you pay for. It's usually cheaper to spend the money and get good quality the first time around.

 

I could see being upset but I kinda have to lean toward Mullers look on it. If it were damaged by the user, that's where they have to draw the line or they'd be losing money. Lesson learned, if there's an issue with it, send it back. I know, try to fix it now so you can shoot, but then your out whatever money you are if it isn't fixed. I'd take the return deal.

 

Yup.....lesson learned there. I don't know why so many people speak so highly of those scopes anyways....it's not much more than a Bushnell Trophy IMO. Buy Leupold from here on out and you'll never have another issue. Even Burris is really good about repairs etc....so they are an option and it's pretty good glass. Personally, I won't buy anything other than Leupold though.....doesn't have to be a $600 VX-3 either.

My first scope was a Burris Fullfield 3-9x40 that I bought in 1998. I steered clear of all the cheap scopes right from the get go. That scope gave up the ghost in 2003 and I sent it back. I received the scope back within 4 weeks. They readjusted the paralax, gave it a shot of nitrogen and sent it on it's way free of charge.....that scope is still used today...it's on my .17 Remington.

 

It really is frustrating as I am not scammer nor did I do anything wrong , Just keeping everyone informed as this came so highly recommended on this forum.

I have had a simmons 8 point scope on my slug gun for over 4 years and it still holds center great. that scope costed me $45 from cabela's on a bargin basement deal.

 

Thanks for the heads up. I agree with you that the response was less than satisfying. And I also agree that they should honor the warranty. I'll make sure to cross them off my list of prospective scope mfg's as a result of this post. Thank you.

 

I hear ya man, it's frustrating.

 

How can you expect us to warranty a scope that looks like this? It looks like someone took a pair of channels locks to it.. It should NEVER of been tampered with. We cover our scopes but not when the end user damages them.. Its not only gouged up from whatever was used, it also bent.

 

I can understand that they won't cover it since it does not look to be a defect. However, the example below is how the top tier companies handle such things........
This is why I stick with Leupold for almost all of my optics purchases. A friend bent his Leupold VXIII on a hunt out west. Wasn't Leupolds fault, yet they made sure they made another lifelong customer by replacing it asap. I'll spend the money up front thank you. I've also had great luck with Burris products and their customer service as well.

Sorry about your luck, hopefully you get it up and running soon!

 

How can you expect us to warranty a scope that looks like this? It looks like someone took a pair of channels locks to it.. It should NEVER of been tampered with. We cover our scopes but not when the end user damages them.. Its not only gouged up from whatever was used, it also bent.

The explanation for said damage was due to a defect as was carefully stated by the customer. Most people are willing to try and fix something themselves and avoid passing on to the mfg needless warranty costs. The attempt to save you money should be considered when making these decisions. Obviously you feel otherwise and as such have denied full replacement. Fair enough but don't expect to win any customers over with these types of decisions.

 

I guess I have to lean towards Muellers side on this one. The O.P. doesn't have the box or the receipt and gundged up the scope so it's irreparable. For all the manufacturer knows he got it out of a dumpster. It's not covered by warranty yet they offer him a $50 discount on a replacement. And they are the bad guys here? It was a $135 scope to begin with. You pay $600 for a Leupold and I can see why you might expect them to go above and beyond the stated warranty but $135? Geez, come on here, let's try and nickle & dime a small company to death.

If I damage a product I buy, then why should the manufacturer take the hit? Sorry, that's ridiculous. I'll take responsibility for my own mistakes instead of trying to get someone else to take care of it.

IMHO, at their price point Mueller makes a decent scope, a heck of a lot better then Simmons or TASCO or Barska or low end Bushnells that compare in price. I own a wide variety of scopes including Muellers as well as Leupolds and other high end scopes. You won't find another decent scope with an illuminated reticle that is comparably priced to Mueller. For certain applications, I'd have no problem buying another Mueller in a heart beat.

 

The explanation for said damage was due to a defect as was carefully stated by the customer. Most people are willing to try and fix something themselves and avoid passing on to the mfg needless warranty costs. The attempt to save you money should be considered when making these decisions. Obviously you feel otherwise and as such have denied full replacement. Fair enough but don't expect to win any customers over with these types of decisions.

My enitre case and Point of this thread. And the exact words I should have used to try and even further state my case for its exchange.



What is interesting is that my hands must be stronger then channel locks as that burring on the edge is from the stop that stands proud on the scope tube. This stand off is there for an end point , that is what gouged the trailing edge of the objective when trying to reassemble it NOT CHANNEL LOCKS.

PLEASE Let this not turn into an arguing with a manufacturer, rather than suggestions for future customers thread. THX

 

Reassemble it? You took the objective completely off? And you called the manufacturer out by starting this thread. I like others I am sure, are just trying to understand both sides.

 

I guess I have to lean towards Muellers side on this one. The O.P. doesn't have the box or the receipt and gundged up the scope so it's irreparable. For all the manufacturer knows he got it out of a dumpster. It's not covered by warranty yet they offer him a $50 discount on a replacement. And they are the bad guys here? It was a $135 scope to begin with. You pay $600 for a Leupold and I can see why you might expect them to go above and beyond the stated warranty but $135? Geez, come on here, let's try and nickle & dime a small company to death.

If I damage a product I buy, then why should the manufacturer take the hit? Sorry, that's ridiculous. I'll take responsibility for my own mistakes instead of trying to get someone else to take care of it.

IMHO, at their price point Mueller makes a decent scope, a heck of a lot better then Simmons or TASCO or Barska or low end Bushnells that compare in price. I own a wide variety of scopes including Muellers as well as Leupolds and other high end scopes. You won't find another decent scope with an illuminated reticle that is comparably priced to Mueller. For certain applications, I'd have no problem buying another Mueller in a heart beat.

Couldn't have said it any better.

 

What is interesting is that my hands must be stronger then channel locks as that burring on the edge is from the stop that stands proud on the scope tube. This stand off is there for an end point , that is what gouged the trailing edge of the objective when trying to reassemble it NOT CHANNEL LOCKS.

Looks plain as day to me as to what caused the damage. Anyone that has experience with this scope could plainly see that what you have stated is exactly the case. The only question remaining is- was the objective turned down past the stop prior to you receiving it or after. Either way I would assume that most mfg's take a customers word for what happened.

 

. You pay $600 for a Leupold and I can see why you might expect them to go above and beyond the stated warranty but $135? .

I bet if you spent $200 on Leupold, they'd give you the same customer service as if you spent $600. Heck, Bushnell replaced a Trophy shotgun scope after the reticles broke 3 years after purchase. I had no box, no receipt etc, they just replaced it. I think that scope cost me $140 at the time. Were the broken reticles a manufacturing defect or did I beat the snot out of it? Bushnell didn't ask, nor did they assume, they just sent me a new one. It's also one on the reasons I no longer purchase bargain glass, but do and will continue to buy Bushnells Elite series stuff, based on both performance and my customer service experience. I'm still partial to Leupold, with Burris and Bushnell Elite a close second.

Again, I can understand why Mueller won't, they certainly don't have to.

I will agree with Munster though, they are certainly a step up from Tasco, Simmons, and Barska, but....they certainly should be!!

 

Michihunter,

You are dead on with your assumptions and it is how you said.

Again I am not trying to turn this into Mueller HATE thread, just an example of a Lifetime warranty that means nothing.

For those with the calling out type responses, how would you play Monday morning quarterback?

 

Lifetime warranty can mean different things... I guess we must understand that...

If the warranty is against defects in workmanship and materials that leaves it open to suggestion with regard to user initiated damage...

If on the other hand (such as Leupold, etc) it is an unconditional lifetime warranty... that is something entirely different...

You get what you pay for.. Much of the price of the "high" end optics comes from the warranty...

If you purchase through a distributor such as SWFA they can be a good aid in some instances...

 

I agree with the company. I had a 2-7 that fogged up, it was an early 2 piece design. Had shot it in september and was fine pulled it out the week before the opener to load up for the trip to camp and noticed it. Called them up immediatly and sent the next day to them and had the new one two days later in time to sight in and head up. I own three of these and have no complaints. Yes you get whay you pay for and I have Leupold and Nikon optics as well, but they have a decent product and I will encourage others to buy them over other brands in the price range. Yes, you had a bad experience with them and I would be upset also but, if I was in thier shoes I would probably agree with them.

 

Again I am not trying to turn this into Mueller HATE thread, just an example of a Lifetime warranty that means nothing.

It appears that you expect an unlimited lifetime warranty where the product will be replaced regardless of what is done to it. If that is what you are looking for, maybe you should shop for the product based on what type of warranty is offered. A quick look at the Mueller website pretty clearly shows what is and is not covered by the warranty that they offer and what you could reasonably expect to be covered. I would not say that their warranty means nothing, just that it is limited, as are almost all warranties.

LIMITED LIFETIME WARRANTY
If at any time during the warranty period a Mueller scope is found to have a defect in material or workmanship, Mueller will, at our discretion, repair or replace it free of charge. The warranty is void if damage results from unauthorized repair, alteration, abuse or misuse. The warranty is transferable and we do not require a registration card to be completed, we only require a copy of the original receipt, which must be from an authorized Mueller Optics dealer. Please be sure when transferring the Scope to another user that a copy of the receipt is also transferred. Mueller reserves the right to replace any product, which has been discontinued from its product line with a new product of comparable value and function. This warranty shall be void if and no force of effect if an Mueller warranty inspector has determined the Mueller product has been abused, misused, mishandled or tampered with in anyway whatsoever.

In the situation described, the OP was both lacking an original sales receipt, the proof of purchase required for the warranty to be applicable and it certainly appeared that the product had been abused and mishandled. Again, it was a $135 scope and they offered you a pretty good discount on a replacement. I'm having a hard time faulting the company for their actions in this case.

 

I'm having a hard time faulting the company for their actions in this case.

Me too. Sometimes people expectations are completely unreasonable. I think Muellers offer was well beyond what one could reasonably expect given the circumstances.

 

In the situation described, the OP was both lacking an original sales receipt, the proof of purchase required for the warranty to be applicable and it certainly appeared that the product had been abused and mishandled. Again, it was a $135 scope and they offered you a pretty good discount on a replacement.

IMO, a reasonable compromise with this scenario.

 

Munster- If you were trying to loosen a bolt on your bow sight that was never touched previously and it broke would you expect the sight to be covered under a limited warranty? Or would you be satisfied that you were considered 'abusive' to the equipment and merely offered a discount? I see this as being the exact same situation and as such would expect them to cover me. I do however agree that the warranty requires a receipt.

Personally I've come to expect that most mfg's will go above and beyond their 'written' policies in order to maintain customer loyalty. I normally seek out those that do. In this particular instance it appears as though the receipt was not the issue so they did go above and beyond in that regard. However, with the above scenario I mentioned, it seems as though the the product was defective to begin with and the issue at hand and therefore all other claims by the mfg are meaningless.

 

Thanks for the thread, it's always good to know customer service experiences good or bad for future reference. I also gave their product a look because of threads posted on this site. I, however, didn't have the same experience in side by side comparisons as some of the advocates here and opted not to purchase a Mueller.

Here is the Mueller warranty if anyone wanted to know what they cover:
http://www.muelleroptics.com/products/lifetime-warranty.html

 

Just my 2 cents!

I purchased a Mueller scope when they first came out. Michigan Outdoors did a small piece on their show about them and how it was great to have a Michigan business producing these. I've always bought Leopold and Burris before but I wanted to get my feet wet with a "cheap" scope. After the story on Michigan Outdoors I decided to give one a try. It turned out that at that time the only place you could get a Mueller was from Gander Mountain. They were "trying them out" as their salesman told me. I bought a 4-16x50 to try on a Colt Hbar elite. In the store the scope seemed fine, but after mounting and the trip to the range to sight it in I was shocked! It was like looking through dirty plexiglass! At 100 yards while looking at the edges of the scope the target would literally disappear into a blur. I sighted it in and shot a few groups with it then headed home. Once home I decided I would contact Mueller and find out if I just had a bad one or they really were that bad. I searched all over the box, no contact information. No brochures or pamphlets in the box with any address or phone numbers. Their was no way at all to contact them!! At 200 bucks it was my first experience with a "cheap" scope! I later discovered that I could have gotten a Burris Fullfied 2 for just slightly more than the Mueller.

Anyway with no contact info at all I was pretty upset with my new scope. A friend called and I told him about the scope and he said that we had worked with the owner of Mueller at a company in Gaylord and he had started the company from his basement. My friend tried to explain to me who he was but I couldn't picture him. Anyway my friend suggested I sell it and buy something else. I just couldn't get myself to stick someone else with this junk scope!! I ended up giving it away to another friend after explaining to him how bad the scope was. He didn't seem to care and I wanted it out of my house.

They used to say long ago that a satisfied customer would tell 2 or 3 people and an unsatisfied customer would tell 11 or 12 people. Now with the internet and forums like this folks can literally tell hundreds of people about their experiences. Over the years I've kept at least a dozen fellow shooters from buying Muellers (based on my experience). For just a few bucks more you can get a low end Burris or Lupy and have something you can be proud of.

I wish the best for the O.P. in his search for a new scope and I appreciate his post and desire to not bash but inform. And I wish Mueller optics the best in their business, and I honestly mean that!

P.S. I no longer pay any attention to advise given on Michigan Outdoors! And I no longer buy cheap scopes. If I can't afford a Lupy, I don't need a scope!!

 

Munster- If you were trying to loosen a bolt on your bow sight that was never touched previously and it broke would you expect the sight to be covered under a limited warranty? Or would you be satisfied that you were considered 'abusive' to the equipment and merely offered a discount?

If I was turning the bolt using the proper tool for the job and the bolt broke because it was defective, then I might assume that a warranty might apply. If I did not have the right socket for the bolt and instead decided to use vice grips and pound on it with a hammer to loosen and it then broke, I would probably sheepishly call myself an idiot for not being more careful and I highly doubt that I would send it back to the company to be fixed, especially not at that price point. After making a hamfisted attempt to fix the problem that resulted in more damage, I most certainly would not accuse the company of poor customer service on an internet forum. But that's just me.

Here is an example, yesterday I was blowing leaves most of the day, the incessant rain that we have had for the last month had paused for the minute and I had a short window of opportunity to clear my lawn. I was using my Stihl leafblower. It's two years old and I love it, starts every time, great blower. I was about 90% done and had just re-filled with gas and when I pulled the starter cord it broke. GRRRR....

I could have taken it into the dealer to get the cord replaced but I figured what the heck, I'll just get it started with a short cord and finish up and replace the cord later. The broken cord had retracted into the housing. The plastic housing is held on by 4 bolts. Instead of using hex head or regular or phillips head bolts, Stihl uses the type that need a star shaped driver, like the shape Leupold uses on their rings. So I rooted around in my tool box and found a driver that I thought was the right size. 3 of the bolts came out easily, the fourth one was stuck. I applied a little more pressure and ended up stripping the inside of the bolt because it turns out I was using a driver that was a little smaller then I should have been using. After muttering and cursing for a minute, I ended up using an allen wrench and was eventually able to get the cover off and the cord re-attached and was able to finish blowing out my back yard. Is it Stihls fault that I used the wrong tool and stripped the bolt head? No, it was my own stupid fault. Should I take it in to the dealer and tell them they should replace the bolt for free because I didn't have the right tool for the job and attempted to fix it myself and fudged it up? After all, if Stihl had not manufactured it with a defective pull cord, I never would have stripped the bolt, right? (sarcasm tag on)

If I do something stupid, I don't expect someone else to have to fix it for me for free.