Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.
Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'South West Michigan Streams and Rivers' started by samsteel, May 28, 2012.
Hitting "Like" button.
Thank you Jarob,J&D mobile and everyone else that is supporting us,we are trying hard to do our best to keep this open and honest on both sides the last thing we want is to have a mud slinging contest! That does no one any good at all!
We need people to help us and come to our Facebook page hit the like button,also ask questions to the Grand Rapids Whitewater people and see if they can get honest tangible answers!
We are nothing more than a Facebook page without all of you and we need to see your support behind us so we can say to the important people who have the ability to shoot down or say go back to the drawing board with this project look we have this many likes,comments and constructive input on what you all as sportsmen think!
Also if you have any paper work that has hard facts about this project we can meet with you to get it and have a drink in support!
So thank you to all of you for your support in opening the eyes of many people and lets keep it going!
NEVER STOP FIGHTING!
What about the St Mary's, for instance? We (especially brother Buzz who goes by Trowoot on this site) have caught numbers of mixed salmon/trout up to the 70s/day, & in the rapids. These rapids are the swiftest water I have ever fished. Why would it be so impossible to fish the Grand Rapids if they were re-establised?
The original plans for this project had half a line in it saying it may improve fishing downtown,so seeing that would lead one to believe that they had little concern for fishing they just wanted their kayak course and had little concern for the rest of the users of the river until we came along and started to ask questions!
We also would like the dam down as well if it works for everyone involved but the plans that we have heard about so far have not been very concrete for the lamprey barrier they need to replace as well as other projects!
Cool beans Bucky, I do look up to you and the others for standing up for for the concerns of the anglers, much gratitude to everyone. I really do value your opinions.
i didnt say it wasnt a great fishery, just not my definition of magical. i have fished it in its prime. it is fun and great fishing. and there are places on the grand where you can have days just as good or better than the dam.
btw i against removal for this park. the idea is absurd that it will help economically. not to mention displace a large angler population who either dont have the time or funds to travel.
Posted via Mobile Device
Here is the proposal that was presented at the Grand Rapids Museum, it was linked from their site. It was kind of tricky to find.
Here is a link to my blog about this proposal
An excellent evaluation of the proposed project.
x2 Great blog too.
You have this right. There are many projects that have an effect on rivers that DNR is not the lead on. Developers, watershed groups, cities removing dams, etc. all have ideas or concepts for a project. The DNR can offer advice as to what a good project would entail. However, we can not request that MDEQ deny a permit for a project or deny funding for a project until there is a formal request to do the project with specific plans and designs.
The DNR is watching the process and talking to the groups behind this to offer our opinion. There is great potential to restore the rapids. However, there is a long way to go to get all the details worked out. The conceptual design that they have now has many issues that we are concerned about.
This is still in the early stages. Hell Sputnik hasn't even interjected himself yet. You'll know it's getting closer when he get's involved and proposes building a kayak lodge near the Marriot along with a drift boat only course.
Great links there Mike, thank you, Oh Master of The Chrome. Good info that you have shared.
Keep the masture debate going.........
Holy sheep-ship, is Sputnik still around? I thought he was banned?
A good read overall however I must disagree with your closing remarks. You state a "fishery could be ruined." I think you are mistaking the overall "fishery" with a "fishing spot". A fishing spot (6th street dam) will be altered and potentially ruined by this project, however the Grand River fishery has potential to benefit a great deal from the 100% fish passage dam removal would allow. Dams do great harm to fish populations and spawning potential on river systems, as I'm sure your well aware. The salmon and steelhead wont disappear from the grand river watershed, but fisherman may have to learn new fishing spots to be successful in catching them. In fact steelhead natural reproduction in cold water tribs could be bolstered by allowing their passage during cold water periods when they are unwilling to move through the ladder. Allowing them to get to spawning water with a more prolonged natural run timing will potentially help reproduction. Other native species like wallye and sturgeon could benefit tremendously from the dams removal. Would fisherman be for the dam's removal if there was no kayaking group involved? I would hope the answer would be yes, if not all we would be protecting is an artificial fish trap that stands in the way of rehabilitation of native species.
I agree with most of the benefits you mention and yes it would NOT be ruining the fishery, It would be "ruining" a fish'n spot ( 6st dam removal ). I'm not going to sugar coat the fact that it is a place that is a " fish trap " as you say and this draws a large amount of fishermen & women because of that. But unlike many other dams that have no fish passage that also draw a large amount of anglers 6st can be passed and is passed very well ( If a fish is to stuiped to find the damn ladder I don't think we want them in the gene pool anyways lol ). As far as the steelhead not using the ladder in cold water conditions, so what there not dieing from this ( unless they get strung ) and there not going to spawn until after the water is warm enough for them to use the ladder again. And as far as fishermen may have to find new spots to be successful in catching them, that may be true for a newbe but for the seasoned fishermen we'll have to go to I wouldn't say new but different spots to get into big numbers of fish. There is a dam not far from town ( trib of the Grand ) that is not passable, trust me that one will turn into a way bigger zoo fast as well as many other spots. So as I said before kayakers are not going to bring in the money to the downtown economy by a fraction of what the fishermen already do witch will decrease to very little if the dam is removed. Are the kayakers going to make up that deference? HELL NO
:: It has been said already but if the DNR wants to improve some fish percentages by I can't even imagine, plant the damn king salmon above 6st like years ago. Then all them zombies milling around Grand Haven ( where there released now ) would have passed the dam instead of swiming around in circles with no one fishing them like they do now.
:: Hudge waste of time, effort and money. But hay thats the American way right?