Chumming on NRC agenda

Discussion in 'Gear Restrictions and Trout Fishing Regs' started by AdamBradley, Apr 24, 2016.

  1. AdamBradley

    AdamBradley

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    Just checked out the may NRC agenda, and saw chumming.

    Any one have any idea what's up? Is it just now making it to the NRC after the dnr public forums last year? Or is this it coming back up?
     
  2. kzoofisher

    kzoofisher

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    Haven't heard a peep about any groups wanting a change, a few guides are the only ones AFAIK. Maybe the NRC is tired of them harping on it and wants Fisheries to make a statement so it can be put to rest? The cycle for reviewing all fishing regs is just starting, new rules will be in 2018. I predict the biggest discussions will be on trout regs (are you wearing your shocked face?) and bass.

    Michigan Bass Nation will be pushing for CDR again, I'm not aware of any studies being done to put more science behind that decision but I do miss some things now and then.

    I doubt their will be any push to expand GR water, at least not from the fly guys. The PM will be the battle ground for removing some water, will moving that mileage elsewhere be a compromise?

    UP brook trout limits will come up, too. Those experimental rules will have been in place five years at the end of 2017, will Fisheries be able to reach any scientific conclusions for the 2018 rules? Seems unlikely that they can review the data and draw any conclusions in time. Most likely the NRC will extend the study parameters or just say the heck with science and go with their emotions like people usually do when facts might contradict their politics. Funny how that works.
     

  3. kzoofisher

    kzoofisher

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    Btw, just want to make clear that the previous post is only my predictions. I have no detailed knowledge of the future.
     
  4. toto

    toto

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    No knowledge either but I think you are probably right on as far the chumming and the whining goes. As for the rest of it, I have no idea as I don't know enough about it. I am planning on attending the Cold Water Resource Committee meeting in Clare on May 4, might be some interesting discussions happening there.
     
  5. Robert Holmes

    Robert Holmes

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    The chummers don't know that a couple of handfuls of gravel will produce the same results as a handful of eggs. If they make chumming illegal and a person who throws the remains of a spawn bag into the river might be in violation. For that reason I am in favor of keeping things the same.
     
  6. toto

    toto

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    Not only that but if you look at it that way, we need to stop salmon from spawning altogether, if they lay the eggs, some will get loose, and there's the problem. It makes no sense from a scientific standpoint, it's only from a few greedy guides that this is even being talked about.
     
  7. kzoofisher

    kzoofisher

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    That's open to the public, right? Got a location and time?
     
  8. toto

    toto

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    May 4, 10 am Jays in Clare
     
  9. kzoofisher

    kzoofisher

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    Thanks. Maybe see you there.
     
  10. Benzie Rover

    Benzie Rover

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    Come on Robert - even in your unpressured steelies in desolate UP streams are not dumb enough to get triggered by throwing pebbles - that sounds more like how Jim Teeny used to pelt the summer run steelhead holes with rocks to 'shuffle them around' so the fish would move to the back of the pool where he could cast to them. In reality, if you have ever chummed a fair bit you quickly realize how effective it is. You can literally take a stale pool of fish that simply will not bite any presentation out there, throw 2-3 handfuls of medicine, then wham - fish on for the next 5, maybe even 10 casts - then stale again. Repeat the chum. Then Whammo - and it goes on and on. I've done this dozens of times in my life. If you ever want to reach 100 fish in a day - head to Pennsylvania and bring a secret jar of medicine. They have lots of holes with 50+ fish in them that only need a bit of coaxing with some looses and it's fish on. I mean, don't get me wrong, steelies will do some really stupid stuff - had them hit a bobber, inhale my slinker sinker and we even used to use stale marshmellows in the surf back in the late '70s - yep, they caught few fish. Heck, I grew up chumming with corn when we had no roe at the time, but now we know that's not so cool. But it does work. For me, it's all what you consider sporting and thereby satisfying to the individual angler. If having something in your pocket that will get fish to bite when they otherwise will not bite that can be a great tool for some. But for others, like myself, I've been there, done that and caught A LOT of fish that way back when I was a 'number' fisherman. The 'numbers' stage is something most hardcore chrome addicts go through and some never grow out of.
     
  11. Benzie Rover

    Benzie Rover

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    Toto - I'm not in favor of making the practice illegal, but, people should realize the impact that it has on the fishery. It is not like a salmon spawning in anyway. Chumming is an artificial concentration of roe in resting and holding areas that makes steelhead far more vulnerable to being caught then they would be otherwise. Natural salmon spawning riffles create a natural concentration of roe in a shallow riffle area. Of course there are opportunistic trout and steelies there, but it's not a spot where they are resting and holding, they are there with the intention of feeding on eggs and will always be in a lower density than a large, deep, swirly hole with lots of wood. Again, I am OK with this personally as I feel it's the angler's decision as to how he wants to take his fish and not mine to judge your preferred method of capturing your fish, BUT, IMO, it would be great if folks that used this tactic understood that they are wielding the most powerful steelhead tool out there - in other words, no tactic will ever catch more steelies than spawn fished properly in conjunction with properly timed chum. There is no doubt that if you're throwing flies or lures or whatever and some dude is fishing for the same fish as you are, but he's chumming and has at least a clue about presentation and how to fish spawn, then he's going to catch A LOT more fish out of that same run as you are. Throw in a center pin and this technique can now cover as much water as it takes 3-4 anglers to cover with other techniques - and so the numbers go even higher. At the end of the day, it's all about how you enjoy bending the rod. I've personally grown out of the need to hook more than the dude next to me, but I'll be honest, it took 20+ years of fish on the bank to get there... whereas my 12yo son has a few more fish to go it would seem, steelie wise. I've made a promise to take him to PA this fall for the circus. Trout wise though, he won't fish with bait or spinners any longer, which is pretty interesting to me. Anyway, fish on.
     
  12. toto

    toto

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    I agree with you, and in all honesty I don't really care either way, I don't chum and never found a reason to do so. My only issue is who is doing the whining. If were about a thing of fair chase, no problem, but when it comes down to "I'm losing clients because the other guy chums and catches fish etc" that's where the problem comes in, at least for me.
     
  13. Robert Holmes

    Robert Holmes

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    Benzie I don't fish gravel. I fish holes and until you have tried it you would not know if it works or does not work. I learned the trick from a a guy that has probably caught more river fish than 99% of the guys on here who think that they can catch fish. One day he was not getting bites so he threw out a couple of hand fulls of gravel and caught 2 steelhead. Another hand full of gravel and another steelhead. I have caught many fish many times out of holes tossing gravel so why waste the gold. The gold might work better but when it is not so available I am not going to waste it. If you have loads of gold go chumming when you run out of gold try the gravel and you will be saying gee that guy on MS was right. You can also nail a few by throwing a spawn bag into the backwash of a passing boat. All that tossing gravel does is it gets their attention the same as a flashing lure. I fish trout in the LP also.
     
  14. Trout King

    Trout King

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    Those guides just won't let this issue die....

    They have cried their river, now they need to build the bridge and get over it.
     
    JVoutdoors and Robert Holmes like this.
  15. JVoutdoors

    JVoutdoors

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    Well I hope they do not ban Robert chumming with rocks. That would just be wrong. LOL. You Yoopers are trend setters. I was introduced to SH fishing with mini marshmellows up there 25 yrs ago. Thought they were messing with the troll but we caught some fish...