Carp and Chocolay Today!!

[Handlining Rules]

Hey everyone-

Well i decided to make my opening day today...am going to hit both rivers this afternoon...I've got a feeling after the rain we had yesterday, that today is going to be the day..will report when i get back...

[gomer]

from what i have heard from Pikedevil, those rivers are EXTREMELY high...

[Rat Fink]

Please use discretion when mentioning UP streams. :bash:

[sunup]

Don't worry about names, there are only a handful of streams open now and none of them are secrets.

[AceMcbanon]

Went this morning tuff to fish, but it dosen't look like the runoff is gonna be to bad this year, should come down soon enough. Almost took a nice plunge on the carp today when my strap button on my waders fell off.

[Handlining Rules]

Rat Fink, sorry about giving away names of rivers....didnt really think it was that big of a deal.....

ANYWAY

Hit "one" of the places mentioned above today and like Gomer said....EXTREMEMLY high...the trail was even in the water....had one shaker on for about 3 seconds floating a sac.....moved to another location close by....

Talked to a guy who had caught two last sunday on HOt n Tots...one 7 pounds....saw a couple of people casting spawn out into the lake....personally i think some fish are in there already....but it;s only going to get better
Again, sorry if i got anyone excited about giving away names of rivers...just got al ittle excited about going out today...it wont happen again ;)

[AceMcbanon]

Don't worry about it hand, there is only 3 rivers open in the biggest county of michigan, well i guess 4 if you count lower harlow creek. Either way they are obvious and you ain't ever gonna produce the resultes of the lower michigan rivers. I will be on the chocolay bright and early tommorow hope to see you there.

[Handlining Rules]

Hittin the Choc. early tomorrow am (sunday)....anyone else of the other handful on this site goin?

[pikedevil]

the rivers are a bit too high for my liking, and the mass amount of bumkins out makes it about impossible to find fish that havnt seen 3927329 baits already.

Also why hasnt this been moved to the UP rivers forum yet.

[AceMcbanon]

Hit the choc this morning with nadda to show, went to the carp and got one about 4 pounds on a hot and tot, just a bit upstream from 28, buddy had a couple takers on crawlers but lost them both

[Sam22]

call me a hard ***** :bash: , but I don't think those rivers should be mentioned, they are too small and fragile. I know it's the UP, but crowding is a problem here as much as anywhere when you put number of people against number of fish. Just my 2 cents.

[Rat Fink]

I agree Sam22. I lived up there for 5 years and spent many hours on the rivers in the area. All of those streams have good natural reproduction. The hilljacks come out in force once the "word" is out that there are some steelhead in. The migration of bank billys rivals most of what I have seen down here in the NW. Posting on here only makes it worse cuz it spreads the word faster. They are all smaller streams that are fragile fisheries and I am appalled that the UP has been left as an open forum to toss around names like this. It is a wonderful place thats needs to be treated with respect. Seriously why must one post reports about these places? Does it make you feel like a Great Fisherman to throw up a few pics and a report on how you killed em? I learned a long time ago, that is the worst thing you can do. Talk about bringing undue pressure on a system. I'd hate to see you learn your lesson at the expense of some of the states best natural and scenic rivers.

[UP_ROKTOY]

I miss fishing the carp and chocolay, got my first steelhead on the chocolay.:(

[AceMcbanon]

There is barely even any access to the chocolay in the first place, and it is right on the highway where people fish same with the carp. I fished the carp and other then down by the mouth only saw a couple guys, the only place i have ever seen been crowded is the dead river, but these days seem to have a lot less people fishing it, i remember when it use to be almost shoulder to shoulder some days. Not like a ton of people are gonna drive over for a chance at 1 or 2 fish, i get skunked far more often then catching any, mabye that is just me but i normally don't see very many people with fish either. The runs you all remember back in the day are a lot less now, since the salmon and steel populations in the big lake are half of what they use to be

Not to mention there is about a total of 6or7 miles of river in all the county open to fishing, two of the rivers are in the city of marquette, the other is about a mile total of public fishing area, if that

[pikedevil]

The amount of bank billies and clueless fishermen is worse here then anywhere i've ever fished in the entire state. Nothing like a truck pulling up and 6 guys jumping out and throwing spinner baits for steelhead because "some guy" got one here last week. The pressure per fish here this time of year might be worse than anywhere else in the whole state, pretty ironic when you consider its the UP and noone is supposed to live up here.

[UP_ROKTOY]

When I went to NMU I would fish both rivers quite often and rarely did I have to share either with more then a handful of "billies".

[AceMcbanon]

Me and my pals are definetly the clueless type, we never do to well for steel, and i think it's part of our glorified tradition to come home with the skunk, either way it's fun and with so little places to fish right now i have no idea why anyone would expect little crowds on the only open water other then the big lake, especially since two of the rivers are in city limits for the most part. As to everyone else fishing down there never had a problem in the spring everyone is pretty accomodating and spread out, most don't even fish good holding water, just cast and hope for one, no problem there.

[Handlining Rules]

personally i think everyone that fishes there already knows the lingo....and have already fished there before...up here, i highly doubt anyone is going to read this and make a trip up here just becasue they read this...
my 02. cents...
people that fish there, know what they are doing already....take a survey down there, i bet many are not members of this site

[Handlining Rules]

after re reading some of these posts,,,, ive decided i am done posting here...all i ever get is negative feedback complaining about something that really isint a big deal....not to mention all fish i catch, i release, so i will post no pictures of fish in a cooler, like some others....
Im tired of people hopping on others on here....it just seems like some people are members on this forum only to get pleasure to ream people out...
I personally believe there are more than enough fish for anyone...last time i checked fisherman were kind and courtious...and you know what...they were all out on the river...the only negative place about fishing i have experienced this year has been on this site....I think you really need to think about that if you disagree

[Handlining Rules]

.... Posting on here only makes it worse cuz it spreads the word faster. They are all smaller streams that are fragile fisheries and I am appalled that the UP has been left as an open forum to toss around names like this.

[Rat Fink]

Please, quote it again. :lol: Sometimes the truth really stings. I dont post just to ream people. I will always bitch about people exploiting the UP streams until the Mods reclassify them into a no naming policy. I am not worried about people making a drive up there to fish. Maybe you havent spent enough time on the rivers there to know what word of mouth does. Public accesses start to look like the Tippy area with trash, cars and bank billies. But hey they are all "locals" so it's their right to be slobs. Maybe I care too much about a few of our resources that havent been totally screwed up yet and would like to see them protected in a conservative way. Afterall that is what conservation is about protecting the resource.

[#1duck]

Rat Fink,
Internet forums are about sharing information. Whats wrong with finding out what the fishing has been like on a certain river. No holes were mentioned. Its not like these rivers are a big secret(in fact you can find them on a map). I think that you are being greedy, these rescources are meant for all of us to enjoy not just you!. If you dont want to help your fellow sportsman be succesful in their pursuits then dont, but dont come down on other people for trying to help another guy catch a fish. They dont all belong to you! :sad:

[Rat Fink]

Rat Fink,
Internet forums are about sharing information. Whats wrong with finding out what the fishing has been like on a certain river. No holes were mentioned. Its not like these rivers are a big secret(in fact you can find them on a map). I think that you are being greedy, these rescources are meant for all of us to enjoy not just you!. If you dont want to help your fellow sportsman be succesful in their pursuits then dont, but dont come down on other people for trying to help another guy catch a fish. They dont all belong to you! :sad:
What river in Michigan can you NOT find on a Map? You seriously dont get it. Most of the trash leaving, bank eroding, spinnerbait chucking so called steelhead fishermen wont even come out of their cave until the word spreads. And even then they dont catch fish. I am not being greedy at all. Matter of fact I am one helluva upstanding guy who helps out lotsa people with steelhead fishing. I also get helped by others on new aspects of the sport. I share my knowledge with people and they share it with me IN PERSON, especially if it is about sensitive places. I have met alot of guys off of the site and have some good friendships because of it. I guarantee you ALL of them can say I have contributed something to their knowledge bank and they have done the same to mine. I am the first one to acknowledge that the resource doesnt belong to me. But I am the first one to step up and try to make it better rather than exploit it. Here's a generalization for ya that will raise your hackles. MOST not all but most Yoopers are way beyond being helped with advancing their fishing skill and knowledge. It's just the mentality up there. There are very few people dedicated to the sport. Fishing is going out with half *****ed equipment, leaving trash, drinking, tossing out some worms on a hook and if something bites it bites. I lived with yoopers, some of my best friends are yoopers, and many of my teammates at NMU were yoopers. They are great people who will do anything for ya. The only thing I will fault them on is the fact that when Toivo calls Eino and tells him that he caught a Steelhead the next day you can count on an onslaught of bank billies. Happens every year. And at the end of the season accesable parts of the rivers are trampled, garbage laiden and eroded. That is no way to treat a wild semi-pristine fishery.

[AceMcbanon]

Guess i will have to take my camera down tommorow and take a picture of all the trash everywhere, cause i don't see much of it and when i do It gets picked up. Most the trash i see is when all you tourists get up here. I am definetly one of those who enjoy fishing more then the art of catching a fish, i don't really care if I do or not and i don't care how any one else fishes as long as it is legal. And i don't care if there is a crowd, i mean how big of a crowd can you have when there is only one small parking lot at the chocolay, and a dirt one at the mouth of the carp. I fished the carp yesterday up from the mouth and saw two people fishing in my general area, real crowded there was probably 6 cars at the chocolay, wow real crowded, mabye a lot of people for the small stretch you can fish there but that is about it, I walk to the same spot everyday and only once or twice have i seen people there fishing it.

Like i said 6 or 7 miles of fishable river in marquette county untill the opener, Two of the rivers are in the city, We have the majestic mercury filled carp, the nearly all private land chocolay (From Mouth too big creek} and 200 yards of the dead river to fish. Ice is unsafe, lakes can't be fished, where do you expect people to go?

[#1duck]

Rat Fink,
So everybody but you and the people YOU choose to inform with your "knowledge" is a bank eroding, trash leaving, spinnerchucking @$$hole. I think most of the people on this forum are sportsmen intersted in conservation and are not the kind of degenerates you describe. If you think so little of the people on this forum why do you choose to participate?

[Rat Fink]

I dont think little of most of the people on here. As a matter of fact I think very highly of Almost all of the people on here that I have ever met in person and that is a good chunk of the Steelhead crowd. I never said anything about only people I share info with as being worthy so to speak. There are hundreds even thousands of conservation minded anglers out there that I will never meet or have not yet met. And I commend them for their efforts. I have seen firsthand what posting on here will do to a river. You can learn the lesson for yourself. Just dont do it at my or other interested parties expense.

[stelmon]

Excuse me for butting in, but you say there is just a little parking lot? What about the streets that can be parked on.

Also, you want to share information. You first need to know how to rig for steelhead before you catch one. Not having a clue on how to catch steelhead won't get you anywhere. One of the best threads I have seen on this site is how to rig for steelhead. You may have a dozen steelhead in front of you, but casting a spinnerbait won't get them.

I always ran to where I heard steelhead being caught but never hooked anything. I thought there was something wrong. Then I started to study what to use and how to rig. My odds of catching steelhead anywhere in this great state have increased since learning how to even fish for them.

You may not have the crowds now, but give internet posting a few years and you can gaurantee you will have the slobs leaving there crap all over the river. I have never fished the UP streams, therefor I am not greedy but I am totally against the posting of any small and fragile streams, streams in a big city or rivers that have less then a mile to fish them.

However, if you want to tell the whole state of michigan there are fish in your small stream where you barely see anybody, soot yourself:)

[AceMcbanon]

All we are talking about is the three rivers that are open in marquette county, I do catch most of my steelhead on spinners or crawlers by the way, just like i get most my salmon on plugs and spinners, I do all right i am sure something can do better but i like what i use. Also the dnr reports on the rivers weekly once the fishing gets good, i'm sure more yoopers read the paper then get on the internet for their fishing info.

And once again two of the rivers are in marquette city, these are not fragile since hardly any great length of the rivers are open. There will never be cars lined up and down m28, because the fishing is never that good, never. Like i said most people aren't gonna go crazy trying to catch 1 fish, when they can go to the south shore and do far better. As to sight fishing good luck,the main branch of the chocolay is always muddy and carp runs a pretty fast pace downhill in the spring.

[Magnet]

As gas is approaching 3 bucks a gallon, I don't think there will be a huge influx of fisherman heading up and acrossed to maybe catch one. :fish: :dizzy:

[Rat Fink]

As gas is approaching 3 bucks a gallon, I don't think there will be a huge influx of fisherman heading up and acrossed to maybe catch one. :fish: :dizzy:

This is not the issue. I was planning on traveling up to fish at the end of the month. Not with these gas prices though. I'll wait till next year or whenever it is affordable to travel again. The concern does not stem from having a huge influx of tourists coming to fish. Matter of fact IMO most out of towners hold these streams in much higher regard than the locals. Kinda like you dont know how good you have it in your own backyard. I really dont understand how you could think that none of these rivers are fragile fisheries. One of them hasnt been planted with steelhead for a few years and has not been on a regular planting schedule in the past. Yet it still maintains a viable wild fishery. Maybe because you cant get access to other parts of the river doesnt mean that other people can't. Yes there is a limited amount of water open for fall and winter fishing but There is a ton more water out there than what you are leading people to believe. In regards to the fast river that is intimidating to most people. You are not givivng it enough credit. It has a great wild fishery but you need to put some work into learning how to fish it. I understand that is against Yooper tradition but hey why complain about fast water if you dont wanna know how to fish it. The problem that arises is that when all the bank billies come out the fish are sitting ducks in the lower river waiting to head up through the rapids. There is a very limited amount of water in the lower system where the fish sit in holding water making them easy targets for snaggers and other unethical methods ( spears, clubs etc.). Put 100 bank billies on a 1/2 mile stretch of river and you have a problem. Even 50 people is too much for that small tretch of water and I have seen that as a common occurance when the word gets out. If you wanna invite every Toivo and Eino to come fish a 20'-30' wide wild fishery go right ahead, because this site doesn't have the common courtesy to protect it. Protect the Little M sure protect a wild fishery that is very similar in a more sensitive area nah no way. :mad:

P.S. You'll see the trash starting thick in about a week or 2 once word spreads. :lol:

[Northbound]

I was on the carp twice yesterday. In the afternoon I watched a group of about four anglers casting into the surf at the mouth of the river. One older angler brought in a nice four pounder in the short time I was standing there.

Later in the evening I returned rod in hand, the good spots on the shore were taken and a good number of anglers, using hot-n-tots and spawn, were spread out along the river.

The moral of the story is get there before the “After work” crowd arrives.

[Magnet]

Ratfink,
Any stream or river that hold and sustains trout is fragile. You'll get no argument from me there. A trout stream in the lower is just as fragile as one in the upper or prabably more so.

I don't think it's appropriate for you to refer to local yoopers as "bank billies", "snaggers" and "unethical". Just because you are not a yooper doesn't mean that you are naturally born "better" than they are.

Do you consider streams in the UP more sensitive because YOU don't live there and YOU can't fish them everyday?

Also, I don't think that just because someone lives north of you that they are less skilled than you are. :confused:

[Rat Fink]

Ratfink,
Any stream or river that hold and sustains trout is fragile. You'll get no argument from me there. A trout stream in the lower is just as fragile as one in the upper or prabably more so.

I don't think it's appropriate for you to refer to local yoopers as "bank billies", "snaggers" and "unethical". Just because you are not a yooper doesn't mean that you are naturally born "better" than they are.

Do you consider streams in the UP more sensitive because YOU don't live there and YOU can't fish them everyday?

Also, I don't think that just because someone lives north of you that they are less skilled than you are. :confused:

Because we are discussing the UP you are assuming that these terms and statements refer only to Yoopers. You couldnt be more wrong. Bank Billies are everywhere. It is a generic term not referring to just yoopers. I can call anyone a snagger if I see them snagging. I have seen it happen on all of the rivers up there and when I mentioned snaggers it was no one specific just that it is easy for people to do it in a certain stretch of water. Next time you are up there check out some local rivers at night. I do not guarantee you will find it but I have seen first hand on some of these streams definitive proof of spearing netting and clubbing. I have seen it occur and have been told by many there is nothing you can do about it because it would involve the feds and the state wouldnt get involved to stop it. You can thank our forefathers that signed the Treaty of 1836 for this. I do not think I am better than any yooper. I am willing to bet that over half of my friends are yoopers. I have family that are yoopers The list goes on. I am a more skilled fisherman than many PEOPLE yoopers included. I consider the streams in high regard and as a fragile system because they are some of the few wild anadromous fisheries in the state. The majority of them occur in the UP thanks to the isolation of many places, habitat, and the weather. Why would anyone want to compromise that?

[Handlining Rules]

I am a more skilled fisherman that many PEOPLE yoopers included.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Rat Fink]

HR, Thanks for pointing out my spelling error. :lol:

[Oldgrandman]

Some of you people are degrading this sport. To suggest Yoopers are less responsible for the trash and are better fishermen etc., is absolutely ridiculous. I won't even comment on all the BS I've read here. I just hope this string gets yanked by the moderators soon.

[WILDCATWICK]

O.K. this thread has really gone south. RatFink you did balst the Yoopers. MOST not all but most Yoopers are way beyond being helped with advancing their fishing skill and knowledge.

That is just a ridiculous statment. Then you try to say your referring to everyone not just yoopers. Which is it becuase your words are not matching what your saying your intent is. Maybe you should go back and re-read what your wrote and edit those posts to what you truelly mean. Calling out a group of people just becuase they live in a certain georaphical area is the same like being a racist or against someone becuase of ethical background.

Here are some of your words that you may want to look at:

MOST not all but most Yoopers are way beyond being helped with advancing their fishing skill and knowledge. It's just the mentality up there. There are very few people dedicated to the sport. Fishing is going out with half *****ed equipment, leaving trash, drinking, tossing out some worms on a hook and if something bites it bites.
or

It has a great wild fishery but you need to put some work into learning how to fish it. I understand that is against Yooper tradition

or


If you wanna invite every Toivo and Eino to come fish a 20'-30' wide wild fishery go right ahead,

or

The only thing I will fault them on is the fact that when Toivo calls Eino and tells him that he caught a Steelhead the next day you can count on an onslaught of bank billies.

or

I lived up there for 5 years and spent many hours on the rivers in the area. All of those streams have good natural reproduction. The hilljacks come out in force once the "word" is out that there are some steelhead in.


[QUOTE=Rat Fink]I do not guarantee you will find it but I have seen first hand on some of these streams definitive proof of spearing netting and clubbing. I have seen it occur and have been told by many there is nothing you can do about it because it would involve the feds and the state wouldnt get involved to stop it. You can thank our forefathers that signed the Treaty of 1836 for this. QUOTE]

Feds. don't need to be involved if they are breaking the law. But if what they are doing is in the treaty or there has been presidence (sp) then they are doing nothing wrong. Sounds to me like you not only have a problem with Yoopers but you have a problem with Native Americans as well.
Just to let you know I am thankful that there was a treaty of 1836. This way we didn't just "steal" their land and way of living we gave them some things of value and I don't blame their decendents from using what their forefathers had worked so hard to achieve.



I don't know you and maybe your just coming off the wrong way to some of us. But now is your opportunity to set the record straight. Cuz it doesn't look good.....eh? :help:

[Jigawhat]

:yeahthat: ....

[Rat Fink]

I will stand behind every statement I made. I think you are interpreting most everything to deeply. First off I owe a huge debt of gratitude to the entire UP for everyone being so friendly and it being such a great place. Why do you think I respect it so much. There is a huge difference between life here and life up there. The attitude is so much more laid back there. My roomate for a few years was an outdoorsman that grew up hunting and fishing. He probably did it as much as I did when I was young. His attitude was much more laid back than mine when it came to outdoors stuff. Going fishing was basically taking a 6 pack some crawlers and plunking. Is there anything wrong with that? No not at all. Was he a very succesful fisherman? No not at all. He never tried to advance his fishing knowledge even when I would offer to let him use a pre rigged float rod and teach him how to use it, read the water, when to fish holes and runs etc. Nope it was always the same thing I went up the trail to fish runs away from the access points and he plunked in the run by the truck. I would return after a succesful day and he would catch nothing. I saw this attitude EVERYWHERE there. It's worst time is during the steelie run. After a long winter cooped up as soon as someone even starts a sentance with "I caught a stee..." the mass migration starts. Now there are some fishermen I met up there that would humble the best of us. They fish downstate style. That is the only thing for me to compare it too. The styles are just sooooo different. That is why I mentioned it being against yooper tradition. I just didnt see alot of effort form the locals to even try new techniques and spots. It was mostly the same ole throw a worm or whatever in a hole and if a fish bites it bites. Ever read the Porcupine Press? Toivo and Eino came from that. That is a funny Yooper publication. Cant fault me there. Hey look at what happens at Tippy or Sixth street with crowds, scale it down by 20% and there ya go. See what word of mouth does? I wont even start on the NON NATIVE AMERICAN thing cuz I will get kicked off the site so fast your head will spin. I saw what I saw and it was illegal. It continues to this day with no enforcement. in reference to stealing land. To the Victor goes the spoils. Its been that way for hundreds of thousands of years and will continue to be that way in the future. this is an isolated incident of when the conquered were given soveirgnty and land. Guess where I learned much of that in a Native American class at NMU. Bottom line I love Yoopers, the UP and I plan on living there again someday. These are just my persoanl observations of SOME people there not all. granted it appeared to be a majority that fit into my observations maybe it has changed but I doubt it.

[Handlining Rules]

. I am a more skilled fisherman than many PEOPLE yoopers included.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Still can't get over that one

[UBDSLO1]

Some of you strokers never cease to amaze me. If you really want great fishing, then don't post where you go, and name the stream/river you were on. Ever hear, "Three people can keep a secret, as long as 2 are dead." Same with fishing/locations. Would you guys tell everybody about your deer runs, where that trophy buck is, etc? I think not. So why the same with fishing? What gives?

As far as "bank billes" goes, they are EVERYWHERE no matter where you go. Same for snaggers. I wouldn't call "bank billies" sportsmen by anymeans.

Now we have finger pointing in this thread, saying that Rat Fink has a problem with Natives? We did that come from? If you want to dicuss Indians and their "rights", that is another thread in itself, it's MY tax dollars that put salmon and other fish there for them to net in the first place. Let em' go back to the birchbark canoes, try killnetting from those things. Im not going to live in the past, and certainly not going to pay for someone else's actions.

So, keep posting about fragile streams/rivers, and watch your fishing slowly erode away. You'll be saying, "Remember the good ole days?"

[Magnet]

Hey, whatever......

This is getting so anal, you guys seem to be taking this to the point where I can't take my two kids there because someday they'll take each of their kids who have buddies who.................and so on.

This is fishing. There is nothing top secret about it. Urban sprawl is real. The condos that went up behind my house where I use to watch deer and pheasant are real. People are going to fish where the fish are regardless of the internet or this site. It's the way it is and allways will be. You can't change it.

Get used to it. Get real. :dizzy:

[Magnet]

Is there a moderator out there who can close this?

It's over due!

Before things get too personal.

[sunup]

Maybe Rat Fink can. Sounds like he walks on water. :lol:

[Handlining Rules]

:yeahthat: :lol: :lol:

[pikedevil]

Although he seems to be pissing off many, unfortunantly Rat Fink speaks the truth about the mentality and nature of the fishery and fisherman of the Marquette area. I would have never believed it if I didnt live here and experience it first hand, day in and day out. I find me and the very few other successful anglers up here going out of our way to keep tight lips and hide our success and thats not like me at all.

As far as the Indian treaty rights are concerned, I'm stunned that in this day in age we are forced to look the other way as countless WILD steelhead are pitchforked in small spawning streams.

[Rat Fink]

I know I am pissing alot of people off but hey the truth really hurts sometimes. Posting on the Internet about small, mostly wild fisheries is irresponsible and wrong. Pikedevil, You have seen it firsthand so you know exactly what I am talking about here. The next 4 weeks till your classes are out will be a real mess on your rivers. Just like I had told ya hit it before the snow melts. HR if you are so stuck on my skills how about this? You and me head to head clippers only,3 fish limit, max weight, winner takes all. 500 bucks. Your place or mine. NO PITCHFORKS ALLOWED. I've been looking at getting new float and drift rods and this will be an easy way to pay for them. :lol: The only rule is that NO bank billies are allowed. Do you qualify? If so please reply so I can make arrangements for travel if neccesary.

[fishin addiction]

Theres so much mud in this post it reminds me of election 2004. :gaga: :gaga: :gaga: :gaga: :gaga: :gaga: :gaga: :gaga: :gaga:

[Steelheadfred]

MY HEAD HURTS:bash:

[Frozenfish]

move on boyz, enough is enough. I suggest that if you want to continue this do it on in a PM. Absolutely rediculous:rant:

I have never been so irritated by a thread on this site.

Fish how you want to fish with respect for nature. If you want to take a 6 pack and wet a line and that is enjoyable for you, have at it. If you want to hike for a mile and test your skills then have at it. Either way it seems people will do what they want. Enjoy fishing........enough is enough.

[WILDCATWICK]

I lived there for 8 years myself and I also had married a Yooper. So I'm quite familiar with Eivo & Toino. But unfortuntaly you are using it a derogatory way. Apparently you don't see that. Some of us are trying to point out to you that we ARE taking offense. That's why I suggested you go back and re-read and edit it to the point of "meaning what you say". Oh well to each his own.

I will tell you this in my 8 years as a troll living above the bridge I had learned alot about fishing and hunting from Yoopers. Many morning hang around Lindquist's sporting store and chewing the fat were very enjoyable. The people I hung around and learned from were very ethical and practiced great conservation. So they are NOT ALL LIKE YOU ARE CLAIMING. And when you generalize a whole class of people, it comes off as being a bigot. I did see some people who were "bankbillies" as you call them. They were always next to parkiing lots and many of them unfortuantly were trolls.

See many Yoopers are smart, not ignorant as you claim. They know that they live in "God's country" and there comes a responsibility with it. Many need to use the land to compensate for lack of income becuase of the economy in the U.P.. Many of them also know that tourism the largest source of income for their economy. They know that if they screw up the hunting and fishing they will lose a huge amount of their economy. ASk UPNORTHJEFF of this site about how he feels about conservation. I think he might be the most passionate one on this site. He lives there. He has started threads about how poor deer hunting conditions have effected local economies. Many Yoopers understand the connection.

They also understand that if they don't talk about hunting and fishing that essentially they will not be advertising towards tourism and getting people from neighbohring cities into their city.

So when you see someone post about the DEAD, Chocohlay, & Carp. They are only trying to be friendly and to help themselves as well as others. Now if you heard them spewing about the GARLIC, Coles CReek, and 100's of others then you could without doubt say they don't care about the rivers. This is no different than downstate. WE talk about the big ones that everyone knows and we don't talk about the smaller & truely delicate streams.

Hey to each his own. If worm dunkers enjoy themselves...great. If someone wants a beer great. If someone wants to catch the most great, if someone wants to catch the biggest great, if someone wants to keep a few for dinner great. Because this is the bottum line. People fish and hunt to enjoy! Even the ones that you find iggnorant. By the way if you see illegal activities that goes against your conservation ideas and the law. Call a DNR officer.

To each his own.

[Magnet]

WILDCATWICK,

Well said!!

[STEINFISHSKI]

Enough already. This one has run it's course.