Time for New Arrows.

[Bow Hunter Brandon]

Im down to 4 arrows so its time to start looking into what to buy.
Last year I had carbon arrows from Cabela's Im fairly sure they were the Cabela's Carbon Hunters (http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/horizontal-pod.jhtml?id=0004536&navAction=push&navCount=1&indexId=cat20061&parentId=cat20061&parentType=index&rid=&_DARGS=%2Fcabelas%2Fen%2Fcommon%2Fcatalog%2Fpod-link.jhtml_A&_DAV=MainCatcat21424) I shot them out of a SQ2 Muzzy 100 grain 3 blades at 29 inches in the 55# to 70# size and even though the straightness was only .006 I was able to get good groups out to 30 yards and harvested two doe with them. Now last time I was down at Cabelas the guy told me they were a poor chice for hunting. I Guess It could be true but they sure performed for me last year.
This year I wanted to step up in the quility and straightness anyway so Im thinking of going with the Cabela's Carbon SST (http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/pod/vertical-pod3.jhtml?id=0004540&navAction=push&navCount=1&indexId=cat20061&parentId=cat20061&parentType=index&rid=&_DARGS=%2Fcabelas%2Fen%2Fcommon%2Fcatalog%2Fpod-link.jhtml_A&_DAV=MainCatcat21424) The Straightness is .002 and they even offer your money back after 30 days if your not happy with them. Anyone have anything good or bad to say about these shafts. The price seems really good for how straight they are.

[GVDocHoliday]

NOOOOO :tdo12: ...don't get those skinny things. That's the worst thing you can do, the spine consistancy is terrible, and spine consistancy is the most important part. My suggestion for a good durable hunting arrow is the Carbon Express Terminator Selects. "Selects" being the key word. If you are pulling 62lbs or less get the 4565, and if you are pulling greater than 62lbs get the 6595. They are havy, thick walled and will pack a wollup. But don't waste your time or money on those skinny pultruded carbon shafts...stick to the ICS style and you'll be fine.

[One Eye]

I have had good luck with the Gold Tip XT Hunters too. For a little more money, the new Gold Tip Pro Hunters are even tighter on tolerances. I shot Vapor Carbonwoods out of my recurve the last two years, ant they perfomed well also.

Dan

[GVDocHoliday]

Yes, Goldtip XT's are also a very good shaft. In fact I've been using the same three for the last three years and each one as killed several deer. I'm just waiting for them to get busted or something so I can get some terminators...but they just won't. Actually...It might be time to retire them to the wall. Get a nice plaque and just put'em up for rest and relaxation...they've earned it.

[Bow Hunter Brandon]

GVDocHoliday, I would love to hear more about the spine. Why would it be a concern if the skinny ones flew well and grouped well last season why would it be different this year. Also I know that argument of weight vs. speed and tend to come down one the weight side of the argument in theory but in practice like the forgiving nature of a fast light arrow when you may be shooting 24 yards thinking its 20 :) But lets say for arguments sake that I went to the heavy carbon arrow. Why bother I can go back to the Lincoln log aluminum arrows I used to shoot and get the weight and loose the speed for allot less money.

It seems to me that carbons came about to fill the need of speed. Once your start making the heavy and big aren’t we really just reinventing the wheel or in this case the aluminum arrow?

[thornapple]

Easy on the aluminum arrows there Brandon. :) Carbons may be all the rage as of late but aluminums will be shot by many for years and years to come. I tinkered with carbons for a while but when it came to sweet broadhead flight I always go back to my XX78 selects. Good luck on your search for the right carbon toothpick. ;)

[GVDocHoliday]

Truth is, no carbon in the world will have the spine consistancy of aluminum and aluminum will never be as tough and durable as carbon. Most people nowadays look for durability and longevity. I for one don't agree with the light arrow fast speed principle. A deer will jump a 340fps arrow in 20 yards just the same as a 245fps arrow. Speed really is no factor in my opinion, just a good selling point because regardless of what the facts say, people will always go for more speed.

Why is spine so important? Spine is basically the measure of flex a 28 inch arrow undergoes during the moment of release...which is the most important moment of arrow accuracy. You could have an arrow with a straightness of .010 and still fly accuratley as long as it's spine is consistent with the rest of the group. But you could have three of the straightest arrows in the world, I man imeasurable with a micrometer, and if their spines are say, 100, 200, and 300, they will not have the same POI. The problem with pultruted carbon shafts is their spine breaks down, and the manufacturing process also creates inconsistancy problems. The ICS style carbon shafts, such as goldtips, carbon express, and Easton/Beman arrows use a carbon wrap manufacturing process with utilizes 5 layers of weaved carbon that is much more uniform in mass, straightness, and in spine.

[Steve]

Doc, I tend to agree and think I'll be sticking with my XX78 logs for some time to come. My broadheads fly sweet and I don't need mechanicals to get to the same place as my field points.

IMHO, the only thing speed gets you is flatter trajectory over distance and thus you don't have to worry so much about exactly how many yards away your target is.

[mich buckmaster]

Doc, I tend to agree and think I'll be sticking with my XX78 logs for some time to come. My broadheads fly sweet and I don't need mechanicals to get to the same place as my field points.

IMHO, the only thing speed gets you is flatter trajectory over distance and thus you don't have to worry so much about exactly how many yards away your target is.

Steve that is a good point. I went with carbons last year and I am shooting faster only needing one pin out to 30 yards.

[Steve]

Steve that is a good point. I went with carbons last year and I am shooting faster only needing one pin out to 30 yards.

That would definitley be a plus.

[Banditto]

I think along the same lines as Steve. I switched to Beman hunter carbon 4 years ago, and that lasted a year. After about 10 months the carbon arrows were either falling apart or shooting like crud. So I switched back. I will try again in a decade when they have it down to a science and the cost down. Aluminum arrows shoot straight and mine last a couple thousand shots.

[Pinefarm]

If someone is on a tighter budget, then budget arrows are just fine and kill a ton of animals. But think about the irony that a lot of guys will spend $600 plus on the bow, $300 for scent lock camo, $200 for the finest boots and another $300-800 for sights, rests, releases, quivers, binoc's, range finders, etc, and they will then skrimp on arrows. Either because they don't think that any arrow is worth $10 a piece or don't understand what a great arrow, both tolerence and correct weight wise will do for them. Arrows are actually what you're shooting at the deer. Get at least very good arrows and great arrows if you can afford them. You want good consistent straightness and weight tolerences. In my opinion, ACC's are the way to go and I'm beyond happy with them. But you'll spend $130-150 bucks dozen. But shooting cheap arrows out of a $700-$1000 set up doesn't make much sense when you think about the fact that it's the arrow itself. It's like putting a cheap AM radio in a Porsche. Now I can understand guys on a tight budget, putting $300 into their whole set up trying to keep it cheap with arrows. I completely understand that. But in the scheme of things, is $70 really going to break the bank, when that $70 may be mean the difference between night and day in your shooting? I think arrows are the most overlooked part of the bow equation. IMHO Just something to keep in mind.
http://www.eastonarchery.com/products/bowhunting/accSuperlite/default.asp

[deputy]

just switched from carbon express shooting the cx selects 400

but just landed with goldtips as a sponser and am shooting the pro hunters and they are great

[DEERSLAYER]

We shot the Cabela's SST's way back when they were AFC's. We could shoot our nocks off at 20 yards and the penatration of that small shaft was simply AWSOME! Especially through bone. I have actually thought about going back to them (I shoot Carbon Express now), especially now that I could use a drop away rest to get good fletch clearance when useing a decent offset. We didn't shoot thousands of rounds a year, so maybe we didn't wear out the spine so to speak, but did I mention the penatration was AWSOME? :yikes:

The only negative thing I can say about them is that I know Cabela's has "tinkered" around with them some, as the outserts have become shorter. A friend also had to get customer service to send a couple more outserts because his broadheads wouldn't screw in all the way (bottomed out). I'm not sure how much I trust them because of this or I would already be shooting them. Again.

I sure wish somebody would make a good wraped shaft with a real small diameter.

[One Eye]

While I agree with Bob' statement on the arrows being more important than the bow, some of the prices on these "new" carbon arrows is getting crazy. While they are truly works of science, only the top end carbons can match the straightness tolerances of XX78 aluminums. Makes you wonder, doesn't it??

Dan

[GVDocHoliday]

When I still had my PSE Baby G, I was shooting a 29inch long 2315 at 245fps, one pin set at 25 yards and I was good from 10 to 32 yards. I'm shooting a 412 grain arrow now at 275 and at the same yardage, I'm good from 8 to 35 in a six inch circle. I aim for the center torsoe so I'm all good with that. Plus, of all the deer I've shot none have been over 20 yards...none have even tempted me past that, I seem to set up my stands just right and they walk right in.

[thornapple]

Thats right One Eye. And along with the skyhigh premium carbon prices I can buy my XX78 select shafts for $52.00 a doz now. I can remember paying more for the XX78's with the standard uni-bushings.

[Byron]

Maybe I'm just weird, but I don't see any reason to pay more for carbons than aluminums.

Now, I didn't say I don't shoot carbons. I just won't pay more for them. I've bought a few dozen Redhead brand arrows from Bass Pro Shops in the past five years, and pay between $45 and $60 a dozen, depending if I want dipped and crested arrows. I don't see anyone else posting that they use these arrows, but they've put a lot of deer in my freezer.

They're tough, roughly equivalent to the weight of the 2413 aluminums I shot before, deliver incredible penetration, and are plenty accurate despite their "horrific" +/-0.006" straightness.

Best Regards,
Byron