One Buck Limit but with Possible Bonus Buck License

[bwiltse]

How about a one antlered buck limit with the potential for a bonus buck license if your buck has 4 points on one side? Or a limited drawing for a second buck? or???
(And the second buck would have to have 4 points on one side.)

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Boyd

http://members.tripod.com/~mmbqdm/Logo/qdmalogo.gif
Quality Deer thru Sound Deer Management

[Stinger]

Nope.

[LONE WOLF]

I would love to see the state go to a one buck limit. I would also like to see the shooting of spike bucks outlawed. In areas where the buck to doe ratios are way out of wack, such as where I live, make it a requirement to harvest a doe before you are able to kill a buck. I know this will never happen, but one can dream I guess. God Bless and Happy Hunting.

[Steve]

Sounded like a decent proposal to me. What didn't you like about it Stinger?

[Stinger]

It places the emphasis on shooting bucks, both big bucks, it's just reafirming the buck mentality we have here in Michigan. If (imho) we dwell on taking more does the bucks will see less pressure and live longer.
There seems to be thinking that too many guys take two bucks a year and I believe that if you look up the numbers of bucks taken on the second tag they are few and far between. How many guys take two bucks in a season? Not that many. So in my opinion we are still dwelling on the wrong portion of the deer population. Concentrate on taking does.

[farmlegend]

I support a one buck limit without any "bonus" antlered tags. Here are some reasons why:
1. A one buck limit will save far more bucks (primarily yearlings) than merely the number of bucks which are harvested by hunters using their second buck tag. As it stands now, hunters do not hesitate to kill the first antlered deer they have a chance at, knowing that they still have another tag in their pocket to save for another buck. A one buck limit will cause more hunters to hold off on that first buck opportunity, perhaps waiting until something "better" comes along. The reality of hunting being what it is, that something better often will not materialize, and a yearling buck hence will be saved. I know this to be true from my own experiences from the days when I would launch an arrow at the first 1.5 year old buck to come by in October, saving my other tag for a chance at "Mr Big". My guess is that a one buck limit will save more than double the number of bucks harvested on second buck tags. And remember, probably better than 80% of the "saved" bucks are 1.5 years old, the most vulnerable deer in the herd.
2. I believe that one antlered buck is plenty for one hunter. If more venison is needed in your freezer, please harvest a doe or a female fawn, if you can identify them.
3. The issuance of "bonus" antlered deer tags continues our long and unfortunate tradition of promoting the specialness of harvesting a buck, as compared to an antlerless deer.
To those who really want to harvest two 1.5 year old antlered deer per season, know this: a yearling buck IS THE EASIEST DEER TO KILL IN THE WOODS. Your accomplishment does not impress me.

[Liv4Huntin']

farmlegend: One question about your statement that yearling bucks are the easiest deer in the woods to kill: upon what are you basing this? Is it their 'carelessness' during the rut, the ease at which they may be called in or 'tricked' with decoys or scents? I'm just curious....

I do not purposely try to take fawns (although my very first deer many, MANY years ago was a button - yeah, 'greenhorn' syndrome) but nearly every year I witness some really careless/dumb/curious moves that fawns make. As example: while sitting on a large log just inside a swamp in a snowstorm, two fawns, a button and a doe (isn't there a name for a baby doe???), came to the other end of the log I was sitting on and sniffed the place where I'd put my gloved hand to help me navigate the 'muck hummocks'. The button did a 'puppy snort' and jumped back about two feet. The little doe sniffed then took two more steps in my direction while looking me straight in the eye! I could have touched her with my gun barrel! If I were a coyote, she'd have been dinner. Then they both turned and walked off. I regularly see does let their fawns take the lead, which could get them into trouble.

Another question: am I wrong in assuming that the harvesting strategies should vary from northern to southern lower or, more correctly, from 'harder winter areas' to the extreme lower for taking does? If hunting in a 'low deer number area' I like to let the 'herd matriarchs' walk, based on the teaching they can do to the 'youngsters' of the group (i.e. yarding areas, etc.).

One place I hunt has been overrun with - no way to put it but -a large group of SLOBS, shooting anything and everything that moves (taking multiple deer even before it was legal), taking 'running shots' from 150 yards, wounding many and following up on none, trespassing, shooting after hours, and getting downright vulgar and obnoxious when approached about the above. As a result, the few deer that are left are not only really spooky, but most all of them are very young looking, small in size, and many are crippled, with "hardly a horn among 'em". With no possible way of getting any kind of QDM agreements with this type of 'shooters', is our only hope of 'saving' this herd to wait until these shooters leave the neighborhood???? If this weren't a family property situation, I would leave for 'greener' pastures. (Yes the DNR has been called on numerous occasions and seem to be able to do little to rectify the situation).

I don't mean for this to sound like whining, but it's a situation that I'm at a loss to know how to deal with and am looking for input from all areas. Some of my hunting buddies are ready to 'give up'.... I'd really hate to see that.

[bwiltse]

Great comments! Keep them coming!

farmlegend, I agree that a lot of yearling bucks would be saved with a one buck limit due to hunters waiting for a better one. The same thing happens when it comes to shooting does, hunters wait until later in the season and all of a sudden they can't find one. The one buck limit is a good approach but we don't seem to have the necessary support yet. Keep at it!

And Liv4Huntin' don't give up on QDM and one thing you can do with those violating on the family property is take away their bragging rights. Selling QDM can be discouraging at times but the rewards are great!

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Boyd

http://members.tripod.com/~mmbqdm/Logo/qdmalogo.gif
Quality Deer thru Sound Deer Management

[This message has been edited by bwiltse (edited 07-24-2000).]

[Joe Archer]

Yuck! I agree, I have never taken two bucks in a year anyway. Why should someone who shoots a rack have a chance at a second rack? Heck, leave the second rack to us left hunting. Also, If the deer herd is down in my area I take a legal spike with a bow as opposed to killing three deer with one shot (a 2 year old doe that would twin). When doe numbers are high, I take an adult doe for the freezer. But to say I can't buck hunt during rifle season because I take a nice spike for the freezer with my bow? OUCH! <----<<<

[Tim Baker]

I completely agree with farmlegend on everything he said. Make it a one buck limit and be done with the second tag. And yes I bow, shotgun, and muzzle loader hunt. Michigan wouldn’t be the first state to have a one buck limit, as a matter of fact, Michigan is one of the few states in the midwest to allow a hunter to take more than one buck. We have been spoiled so long that a one buck limit sounds radical to a lot of hunters.

Tim

[Steve]

Yeah, if its one buck then people will make darn sure its a good one.

[Lance]

I only get a few days each year to hunt, I disagree that a one buck limit will make people wait to shoot a bigger buck. I'm going to have 5 days this year to hunt, if I see a spike the first day will I take him or let him walk (I hunt a no-doe zone so does aren't an option)? If I pass and the weather turns bad or any number of other things goes wrong I may not see another buck and I go home empty. I can live with a shutout but I just burned 1/3 of my vacation time and when next season comes around that will be made an issue. I don't get much flack as long as I put something in the freezer. I think as long as there are people in the woods that can't take the time to hunt through two or three seasons,(I could afford to be more patient if I had that kind of time to hunt), the first deer with horns is going to find it's way to a freezer.

[Steve]

Lance, I don't think anybody here has a problem with that. What is more of a problem is someone who gets lucky and goes out and shoots a 8 pt, and can go out and get another license (or combo license during bow season), and shoot a 4pt or spike.

[farmlegend]

Thank you, Tim!
You make an excellent point about other states; allowing for more than one buck tag, as we do in Michigan, is the exception, not the rule. Also, it's worth noting that our herd is more skewed, and produces a lesser proportion of mature animals, than any of the states which surround us.