Suggesting walleye limits to rebuild stock not popular idea

[Hamilton Reef]

Okay, I'll say Lake Erie is colse to lower Detroit River to qualify for this forum.

Suggesting walleye limits to rebuild stock not popular idea

Ohio’s Lake Erie fisheries managers seem to be caught between a rock and a hard place when it comes to their proposed remedies for the lake’s ailing walleye population.

http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20030720/COLUMNIST22/107200116/-1/SPORTS

[Rasdale]

It's not a popular idea in Michigan either. What I don't understand is why the Michigan DNR is talking about only Lake Erie. Why not include Detroit River, Lake St. Clair and the St. Clair River.

[Hunt4Ever]

This has been hashed over before and I still think if it is going to help the walleye, then shut them all down while they spawn.

Also, I could live with 4 fish as the limit, and a 15 inch minimum or even a slot size.

[flyrod4steelhead]

A 15" size limit and a 4-fish daily limit will not kill people. Woopy, you get 2 fish less :rolleyes: The charter boat's are the one that got me. Loosing business because you can only keep 4 fish per angler instead of 6, and they all have to be 15"? Come on, give me a break :rolleyes:


Just my $.02
:)

[nokes]

Maybe charters should think about the future! If numbers fall at their current rate they will be out of business anyway. You can still catch all the fish you want you can only take home less. I never understood why they don't lower the limit, especially in the spring, who needs to take home 5 fish over 5lbs anyway. I think it is funner to catch them then eat them, so let them raise the levels, we will catch more fish, and still be able to take a few home for dinner. Sounds good to me.

[Rasdale]

I don't mind the lower limits or raising the minimum length. Or even doing some kind of slot size. What I don't like is the idea of closing the season in May for Lake Erie that the Michigan DNR is proposing. Ohio DNR isn't proposing a May closer. You might suggest fish in Ohio the month of May, but that won't work. If you launched in Michigan, you have to go by the limits and seasons set. Someone might ask, what if I launched say at Sterling SP went to the Detroit River and caught my fish? I wouldn't want to be in that boat, if a DNR CO asked to see the cooler when I picked the boat back up at Sterling SP. You can't prove they didn't come from Lake Erie. So I say if your going to close Lake Erie to May walleye fishing, you best do it for all connection waters.

[Hamilton Reef]

"It's not a popular idea in Michigan either. What I don't understand is why the Michigan DNR is talking about only Lake Erie. Why not include Detroit River, Lake St. Clair and the St. Clair River." -- Rasdale

I've heard (hearsay) that the Michigan DNR has been thinking of the Detroit River spring run, but I have not confirmed that in personal contact yet. If it is true the word will be passed on through a outdoor writer.

[IT pimp 2002]

Here is the real issue. I dont think the charters or the recreational people even come close to the damage these entities do. Until all parties involved agree it will be big business as usual and we sportsman will continue to pay the price.

[keducation]

I could live with a 4 limit and a 15 inch limit....It would be tough
to live with a shut down during spawn of May - but I could
do a catch and release for a few years.

With the weather we had last spring, I caught walleye in the
dumps as late as the end of June that still were in the spawn...
I think it had to do with water tempretature. :p

[Hunt4Ever]

The real pain will be felt by the commercial netters. In order to get the reduction in the take they want, the commercial netters are going to get hit hard. Think about it. What they probably catch in a month, us "hook-n-line" guys probably get in a year.

So that walnut crusted walleye you order in your favorite sit-down joint will be a few dollars more next year.

[IT pimp 2002]

I would never and I mean never eat a fish dinner out, that came from the great lakes region. 1st off I do it better and second you are contributing to the problem when you purchase the product in question. Same goes for smoked fish shops you see along the coast's
Lixeys Fish near Tawas isnt even Indian, and they sell fish like crazy. They started going out of Oscoda to set the nets too.
Just my .02

[tubejig]

I could deal with a 15" size limit on LSC, shoot I cull the littles ones anyways. A May shutdown woudl be ok if it was only on the rivers, leave the Great Lakes open.

tubejig

[Snoopy]

The recommendations for Lake Erie are for the closure of sportfishing for both April and May. I recieved the report in the mail and they said that doing so will reduce the catch by 40%. I don't believe it for one moment. During April my husband runs charters every day on Lake Erie at Bolles and 10 boats in the parking lot is a great day. The creel surveys for April are almost nonexistent. May is a bit more popular but certainly doesn't constitute 40% of the catch. What is going on is pure politics and the sportsman and charterboat captains are the ones to pay. The only thing that is going to decrease by 40% is our business and tourism. Also the reality is that everyone that used to fish the Lake will just move to the river and increase the pressure there solving nothing and causing more problems. As someone else mentioned nightmares will insue from things like lauching at Sterling and fishing the river will the fish be considered legal? Will you be able to convince the DNR

Some of you out there have the attitude that "it's just May and its Lake Erie. I can still fish the river it won't affect me" The river is next folks because commercial fishing industry is more powerful and proactive than the average fisherman. Too many people like fresh fish and there in lies the problem. I wonder what percentage of the commercial take gets dumped into dumpsters because it got too old to sell. Or heres another one, got trashed because it didn't make the deserible fish size slots. Gill nets are indiscriminate killers.

The DNR is meeting Aug 14 to discuss this issue. check the agenda at http://www.michigan.gov/dnr Contact Teresa Gloden at 517-373-2352 to find out how to get onto the public discussion speaker list.

[Spanky]

Like I said before, to close erie for april and may, while leaving the daily slaughter on the detroit, and st.clair river unchanged , is not only unfair to concerned sportsmen, it just doesn't make any sense whatsoever. And I agree with you snoopy. It will not reduce the fish take by 40%. I believe the report actually states that, by the introduction of all the restrictions lakewide. They are hoping to reduce the total harvest by 40%.
The comercial fishers are gonna take a big hit too!

welcome to the site!

[Hunt4Ever]

Originally posted by Snoopy
..... Also the reality is that everyone that used to fish the Lake will just move to the river and increase the pressure there solving nothing and causing more problems. As someone else mentioned nightmares will insue from things like lauching at Sterling....
.....Some of you out there have the attitude that "it's just May and its Lake Erie. I can still fish the river it won't affect me"


I can't imagine more boats on the Detroit River, especially launching out of Sterling or even worse Erie Metro Park. Pretty soon you won't need a boat to fish the DTR, you could just walk from boat-to-boat starting from shore.

[Snoopy]

I glanced through the proposal and here are some interesting tidbits.

"Despite a well coordinated and very aggressive effoert to slow the negative impacts of poor recruitment and overharvest on Lake Erie's walleye stocks (i.e., implementation of the CPMS), those stocks have continuted to suffer a continuous decline since a peak in 1988." The graph associated with this section shows that there were 80 million fish in 1988 and the LEC has set a baseline conservation of 19.1 million fish. Due to weather and other factors the estimate for Erie in 2003 drops below this level to 16.8 million.

Keep in mind the limits on Erie and the Detroit River were a very generous 10 fish per day and 13" up until 3-4 years ago when they lowered it to 6. From my view the number should have been lowered to 5 and 15" years ago and we wouldn't be facing closures now. This management philospophy is beginning to resemble our deer herd management. Decimate-eliminate harvest-rebuild-decimate



They also have a table of cummulative harvest.

April accounts for ~1% of the harvest
by May we have taken 13% of the harvest
June gets us to 51%
July we hit 94%
August is 99%

anything taken in Sept and October is exceeding the limit.

They say that closing April and May will reduce hte catch by 40%. The numbers don't add up -- must be new Math.

[Snoopy]

In this months issure of the Ohio Lake Erie Charter Boat Association newsletter Captain Paul Pacholski make's some very interesting observations and suggestions.

He believes that 90% or better of the fish taken in March and April are males. (On my husbands boat he throws all prespawn females back and only keeps males. I think many others also practice the same.) He suggests that it is better to protect the prespawn female in the Fall and Winter when they are carrying there eggs. He notes that in the fall a very large percentage of his catch is egg laden females same with the ice fishing season. He suggests that the catch rate should be lowered during this time period.


From an economic standpoint closing 2 months is devastating for the charter industry and tourism. Loose 40% of your business, how can you recover from that? Increase your rates for the rest of the year by 167% to make up for it? No one will pay it.

On the other hand the commercial industry can absorb it easier.

1) Reduce their waste; eliminate gill nets; sell what you got not just the choice
2) Pass the costs on to the consumer as always. Less work for the commercial fisherman same amount of money.

Consider this
$500 charter x 167% = $835
$60 motel room x 167% = $100

$8/lb walleye fillet x 167% = $13/lb
$14 dinner x 167% = $23

Which is easier for the consumer to absorb and keeps people employed and entertained? I'm guessing that a lot of fisherman and charter customers will buy their fish next year. Sounds like the commercial industry will cry all the way to the bank once sportfishing is put out of business.

Here's another thought what besides fishing is worthwhile to do in April and May. Will go stir crazy!

[Mike Thomas]

Snoopy: You are a little confused about the forecasted harvest reductions. The 40% reduction that is expected will be achieved with 3 changes...a higher size limit (13 " increased to 15"), a reduced bag limit (from 6 fish down to 5 or perhaps 4), and finally the no harvest regulation for April and May. You are exactly right in that only 13% of the Michigan Lake Erie walleye harvest occurs in April and May, based on the average for the last 7 years of creel survey data. So IN COMBINATION, these three changes are expected to provide a 40% reduction to the Michigan Lake Erie walleye harvest. You should be able to find all the details on this in the report you have in hand. By the way, many other alternative regulatory scenarios have been examined, and a group of sport and charter anglers found this proposal to be the most desirable of the lot. Overall it is the least drastic. If you want to discuss it with me feel free to call me at the MDNR Lake St. Clair Fisheries Research Station, 586-465-4771.

[Hamilton Reef]

Thanks Mike for explaining this more clearly.