Skybusting

[3006]

Just wanted to vent a bit on this subject. I can't recall how many times I saw "hunters" at the managed areas bust at birds. The first time I see it happen with a group of guys, I generally let it slide as I know how intense the moment is when you have a bird do a flyby. We all do it once it awhile. However, when the busting is consistant, I start to get upset, especially when birds want to work a field. All it takes is that one party in an area to ruin a hunt for everyone else. Every so often, I feel the need to calmly confront these "hunters" about their actions. Sometimes the situation is resolved and everyone then has a good time and gets to cleanly shoot a bird. Other times, they act like idiots and bust on purpose thinking they are getting even from my polite confontation. In my mind, these "hunters" do not deserve to participate in the sport until they clean up their act. Until then, all they will do is give the true hunter a black eye.

How can this be prevented? I hate to say this, but one way could be to decrease the shell limit. I personally have never shot a full box of shells at a managed area in one outing in over 10 years of hunting and I have been able to take care of cripples and shoot limits of birds. However, what is to stop a person from taking in more shells. I see it happen all the time with the current limit. Even see a few fresh lead shells laying in the water every now and then too. I wonder how those got there?

Well, let's try to make this season better than previouse ones. All I can say is if you see this happening, go ahead and report it at the check station.

[WEEZER]

Yeah i know where you are coming from on this one!!!! I do nearly all my hunting at manages areas in the tri cities area and see this type of behavior nearly every outing!!
For this reason I kinda avoid two areas (Fish point and Nayanquing Point) to be particular!!!! these two places are the worst.
I think the only solution to the skybusting thing is to limit the shells!!! I remember when you could only take in 15 shell at Nayanquing and the skybusting wasn't that bad. I think they should limit the shells to 17 and really enforce it.
BTW I don't skybust and I have ran outta shells two times(25 rounds). Most of them were used shooting my cripples.

[Mr. 16 gauge]

The only way you will prevent people (not hutners) from sky busting is TAKE AWAY THIER $%#@&#^ SHOTGUNS! There was an 18 shell limit last year at Harsen's Island in all areas, including the marsh (the previous years was 25 rounds in the marsh, 20 in the corn). With all the fair weather we had, any duck that could be seen, let alone be in range, was shot at......the limit didn't stop people for skybusting in the least! Nor did people stick to the 18 shell limit, as we counted 54 shots from the area next to us and watched two violators leave that area that night....when I reported it to the "official" at the headquarters, his response was "well, there is nothing we can do about it." Seems to be their typical response for any violation I have seen and reported! Also, not all of us are olympic trap shooters....some of tend to miss more than others, and it takes somtimes 2-3 shells to kill a cripple. What is next to combat sky busting...limitng everyone to just 6 shells, one per duck? I think that a reasonable limit is 25 shells per hunter. People just skybust anyway....they aren't hunters, they are shooters. How about giving us a break on our licenses, or the managed area fee, if we come back with more shells than we shot? How about getting some of those individuals in the "office" in waders, and get them out there counting shots and empty casings or loaded shells? Seems to me that there are other ways of punishing the guilty rather than somebody with good hunting skills but average shooting ability.

[WEEZER]

16 guage, you are dead on! they aren't hunters and the problem will never be solved.
Actually I think technology is making the problem worse! Guns chambered for 3.5, tungsten loads and high velocity shells are giving hunters more confidence in taking longer range shots.
I mean a guy gets lucky and folds up a drake at 50 yards and he thinks that will happen all the time! Furthermore he tells his buddies about it and adds 5 or 10 yards!

[Chad]

The shell limit at the Todd Farm in Fennville is 12 shells, and the area is patrolled heavily. The CO's use faded carharts as camo and walk through the corn and check the hunters. As far as I know, they check every hunting party. They also give out littering tickets for leaving spent shells. Very strict, but also very effective. Chad.

[boehr]

I agree with you Chad, my guys are very strict at the Todd Farm in Allegan County but I really believe that the good, serious, waterfowler has nothing to fear because the good ones are not doing anything wrong. The strictness does keep the poachers away. I also realize that sometimes a good hunter gets caught up in just making a mistake and depending on the mistake is where the officer has discretion to give a warning or a ticket. The main theme is treating everyone the same so the officers are fair to everyone.

[Zak]

Even with the 12 shell limit at the Todd Farm, you see a lot of skybusting. People just get discouraged and start shooting. Good thing that the DNR is thinking of moving the season back later in November for the Todd Farm, there will be more geese. Zak

[Shawn]

Skybusting Sucks!!!! plain and simple. However the actual definition of Skybusting varies depending on whom you ask. Some people consider pass shooting a form of waterfowl hunting. I won't go there.... that's another subject.

Limiting the amount of shells per hunter and shot size limmits is only going limit the number of long shots they can legally take. It will do nothing to stop someone from taking a long shot. I've hunted the Fennville Farm Unit since the early 80's and have seen it happen on dozens of occasions "Close as they are gonna get to me, BANG,BANG,BANG" followed by laughter and a "Shoot'em tall and watch'em fall"

At the Fennville Farm Unit it's gotten worse through the years. Some of this has to do with the increased competition by placing zones closer together and allowing hunters to move anywhere laterally within the zone. Hunters are shooting birds as they make a swing into someone elses decoys etc.

Crippling is a very big factor of in skybusting. It happens more than most realize. Just because people see the bird fly away doesn't mean the bird isn't injured.

Skybusting educates birds. It's safe to say that everyday at least half of the birds at the Fennville Mangaged Area is either shot at, see another flock shot or hear another flock shot at.

This comment is not very popular with most Biologist or game managers. But here it goes anyway. Baring totally inclement weather conditions the number one factor for migration today is PRESSURE. This is why we are not seeing birds at the Fenn. Farm area until later in the year. Peak migration used to be mid to late Oct. now it's mid Jan. When we shoot at birds day in and day out they respond by staying away till things blow over. They are not flying south they're staying up north. When they close down goose hunting in the entire state we become a refuge.

Bottom line moving the dates for the Fenn. Farm unit is only a band aid for a much bigger problem. We need to individually become better managers of the resource.

Shoot small batches and only when they're back flapping.

I'm rambling and just fell off the soap box....it's just such a sore subject.

Shawn Stahl

[Steve]

Welcome to the forums Shawn, and congrats on your responsible hunting ethics.