Pistons need to change

[Greenbush future]

Chauncy needs to go!
Way too streaky
Good scrimage player but not supper star quality, chokes during the playoffs, did it last year and he did it this year too. Not a good leader by any strech.

You can keep Weber too he sucks and is over the hill.

[GMONEY]

Chauncy needs to go!

.


:yikes: :yikes: :yikes: you've lost it man

[Greenbush future]

Your prolly right my head hurts from last nights game.
Come on 5-O clock!

[GMONEY]

didn't you see the comercial? the nba already is hyping lebron jordan being in the finals. its a conspirecy i say

[MEL]

Chauncy needs to go!
Way too streaky
Good scrimage player but not supper star quality, chokes during the playoffs, did it last year and he did it this year too. Not a good leader by any strech.

You can keep Weber too he sucks and is over the hill.

Im as big a Billups fan as you'll find and have two thoughts>
1) Who is available that could fill his shoes? Name one Point Guard, that is available, who you would rather have than Chauncey??

2) Im not a big enough fan to think that he's worth a fat, max'ed out contract!!! I like him but also could live with out him if we made the Right moves to trade him. I dont know who is available but i do know that several teams would be willing to give up alot for a player with his stats!!!

Guess im thinking about fresh blood, Get us a younger, hungry player to
work with. My thinking is that the current version of the pistons are a little old and stale. Inject some new blood, new energy. Im not against moving players when "the proper" deal comes along. Chauncey, Rip, Sheed, Tay. are all available if the right move comes along. C. Web would not be a part of my team next year. However, if he was willing to take a small contract
and be a 7th or 8th player off the bench, then he could fill a role.
I would deal 'Sheed if possable only cause he has PROVEN to us and the entire NBA that he's a head case. Dont get me wrong, when his head is right, he's as good as it gets. But when his head is wrong he disappears!!
I dont know of another player that can be so gifted and yet be so hot and cold. You NEVER know what your gonna get from him. Proublem with sheed is no one will take him with his head and the contract that he's got.

[erodrig4]

i don't think any of their starters are going anywhere, and i wouldn't want them to. anyone just stop to think that the cavs are finally coming into their own? it was only a matter of time before they got to this point. as for billups...the cavs just match up good against him. how many big shots has he hit for the pistons?? to many to count, who hit the 3 that put them ahead by 2 in the closing seconds of regulation?, and who hit the 2 free throws at the end of the first OT to give them a shot at another OT?...this is a team that doesn't rely on just one player to win the game for them...the whole team gets it done...they all hit a bit of a slump...it happens, sometimes at the wrong time. and you guys are acting like the series is already over...there is still at least one more game to play..they win saturday and they are back at home for game 7. what blows my mind is everytime the tigers, or pistons, or red wings lose...according to some of you guys, the whole team needs to be traded away. the pistons have the 15th pick in this years draft, should get a pretty good bench player out of it...and with maxiell emerging in the playoffs, i think he is ready to contribute a lot more in the up coming seasons, along with mcdyess, hunter, delfino (who is the only player i wouldn't mind seeing gone)

[Greenbush future]

Dare I say this Koby!!! He is dying to get out of Kalifornia but I dont see him as part of the team here any more that he isnt at LA.

OK let the words fly

I like Chauncy I just dont think he plays with the heart I seen in him prior to them winning the big one.

Either way no matter Cleveland or Detroit we all know who should win the tittle this year and they arent from the east.

[MEL]

My viewpoint is that they lost to Miami last year, Barely beat the Bulls this year, Barely beat the Cavs last year, and will lose to the Cavs this year!!!
The time for them is past, younger, hungrier teams are catching up.
They are a old team now compared to many other teams. Old age and Playoff B-ball dont go hand in hand. We are seeing that right now.
What i like to see, for the overall health of the team is a trade/Draft that brings in fresh blood. Right now EVERY one of the pistons starters has a trade value and we can make proper deals to bring in younger talent.
Up front, Sheed, Dice and Webb are old, OLD!!! We need to bring in a player NOW to give that player a year or so to learn from the OLD guys.
If you want to go another year with C. Web as our starting center that scary. Bring in A. Johnson, start him next to Sheed or mix him with Maxiell
and let him Learn now, not in a couple years when sheed,dice and web are useless. I like Maxiell but dont see him as a front line player, only a role player, unless he developes a shooting tough.
So my point is, We have players in the late/middle of their careers and will bring BIG trade value for younger, fresher players. Bring in one or two a year to replace the aging players and that way we have a constant supply of fresh young players mixed with seasoned vets. To wait say two more years will result in a huge fall off due to the ages of the team

[CMRM]

I'm not sure I agree, MEL. San Antonio is pretty old, and they're looking pretty hard to beat right now.

IMHO this team is lacking a go-to scorer type of player. If they had someone that could hit shots when the rest of the team goes cold, they'd be pretty hard to beat.


BTW I think Kevin Garnett is a FA this year.

[ahasiec]

Name a Point guard to replace Chauncy....hmmm...Baron Davis..free agent

Trade Rip, Maxiell, the 15th Pick in the draft and Dales Davis, expiring contract for Kobe

[MEL]

Name a Point guard to replace Chauncy....hmmm...Baron Davis..free agent

Trade Rip, Maxiell, the 15th Pick in the draft and Dales Davis, expiring contract for Kobe

Jerry Buss would never take that deal. To weak of an offer.
The stones could not afford that deal. Could not afford Sheeds 13.5 Mill plus C. Bills contract that will be in the 15Mill per year. Kobe im sure would
command 20 Mil per year. Plus he has a clause in his contract that states if another team wants to trade for him or if LA wants to trade him them he gets an additional 9Mil. on top. Stones just could not afford that. Put them WAY over the salary cap!!!
Plus, Joe D. dosent like the Kobe type players, the Diva's that is. Joes already got one head case in Sheed. Dont see him taking another one in Kobe.

To afford Kobe it would take dumping sheed and his 13.5 mill and Chauncey with his future 15mill, you'd have to send them BOTH to LA and toss in the 1st round pick. Perhaps even Amir Johnson in the mix as well.

Baron Davis? interesting. Im not all that familair with him not getting to see him much. He did put on a great show in the playoffs. Played his axx off.
But dont know what his regular season stats and attitude are. Also, dosent
he have physical troubles? Bum knee and/or bad back? Funny i NEVER,EVER hear his name mentioned in the top 4 or 5 point guards in the game. C. Billups is in the top 5, perhaps top 4.

[MEL]

I'm not sure I agree, MEL. San Antonio is pretty old, and they're looking pretty hard to beat right now.

IMHO this team is lacking a go-to scorer type of player. If they had someone that could hit shots when the rest of the team goes cold, they'd be pretty hard to beat.


BTW I think Kevin Garnett is a FA this year.

The Spurs are just a better team than the stones. Look at the Championships, the playoff games and the finals when they beat us.
Yes, they are playing good but they are also the most solid team in the NBA!!!
Dont get me wrong, the stones are a very good team. I am one of their biggest fans. Rarely do i attend less than 10 games per season and depending on the playoff run can go to as many as 20.
But the Bulls gave us fits and they are a young and hungry team. They also get like the 5th pick in this years draft from a trade they made. So you now
have to deal with a BETTER Bulls team next season. The Cavs have put something together, im not sure what it is but they beat us up enough last year that we could not get past the Heat. This year unless we pull a majic trick out of our butts, they will beat us. So what will we do against them
next year? Not to mention the Heat, they still are the Champs and will have D. Wade back in full force next year. They need to fine tune a position or two and they will be back.
It happens in every sport. Good teams, great teams in every sport will only make their runs for so long. I just happen to think that the best way to
keep the winning edge is to bring up talented younger players to replace aging veterans who bring in good trade value. Or if your lucky, you improve thru the draft, but Joe D. does not have a very impressive draft history.
His key has been good trades!!!

Most of my concern is up front. 34 year old bad legs C Web. Do you want to count on him for an entire season next year. bad knees and all? Not me.
Sheed is 32 i think. When his head is right hes hard to stop. but when he starts hearing those voices in his head he can totally disappear!! What can we count on from sheed, key word count on?? Dice is also 32 i think also with knee surgery. A all star before his leg troubles and a valuable 6th man.
He dosent even find his game untill like Feb (midway) cause in the off season he cant keep in shape to save his legs. I like Maxiell, like his energy
love his dunks. But have you closely watched his jumpers? and free throws?
He's just a shade better in shooting than Ben Wallace was. Thats not saying much!!!! Unless he improves his shooting he will really just be a energy guy off the bench that will get a few dunks and some rebounds.
Good for a bench player but you need more from a starter. Plus at 6'7"
he's a small power forward.
So you get rid of C.Web. Bring in a young stud, play him beside Sheed for a year, with Max and Dice mixed in. The following year, sheeds contract expires. You tell sheed that 13.5Mil is way to much money to pay a guy who only shows up half the time. or less. So you deal him, but wont get as much for him as people would think hes worth. Or you keep him on as a 6-7th man off the bench and pay him a fraction of what hes getting now.
But you also develope another young buck to take sheeds place.
When this is done, Billups turns what 33 or 34? Thats getting old for a point that has no speed. Time to bring in a young buck to take over...
So what im doing is bringing in young, fresh talent, and having them play with the vets that are on the team and always refreshing the age and talent of the team. Key here is to get the most out of trades and Joe has proven he can do that.

[Can't Touch This]

Here is the bottom line...

Chauncey leaves and they are a lottery team, it's as simple as that. Is is and has always been the leader of the team. He struggles at times like all stars, but he is the person he runs the team and losing him would be a much bigger blow than losing Ben.

I can only see him going to Denver, because that is where he is from and typically people (ala Webber) later in their career will go back home and play near their home and family.

Keep Tay, Rip, and Billups. Everyone else is good to go. However, i don't think any of it will happen because they are going win game 6, win this series and beat San Antonio in 6.

[MEL]

Here is the bottom line...

Chauncey leaves and they are a lottery team, it's as simple as that. Is is and has always been the leader of the team. He struggles at times like all stars, but he is the person he runs the team and losing him would be a much bigger blow than losing Ben.

I can only see him going to Denver, because that is where he is from and typically people (ala Webber) later in their career will go back home and play near their home and family.

Keep Tay, Rip, and Billups. Everyone else is good to go. However, i don't think any of it will happen because they are going win game 6, win this series and beat San Antonio in 6.

Ok my friend what do you do here? C. Bill looking for that fat,max contract
do you hope you can resign him? Or do you Try and trade him so you get a
young, all star player in return? If you dont resign him, he walks away and we get Nothing, zip, zilch, zero. Ah Al Ben Wallace!!!
And at what price? Bens making what 15Mill/year? So C.Bill should command what 15+ to 17Mill? Between him and Sheeds contract that puts you at the max salary cap. Add in the contract that Joe signed Nazr to and thats some HUGE money You aint gonna be able to sign ANYONE else. No money available for a couple years to get anyone! So we have the same players for two more years. While the Cavs and Bulls and other teams get hungry
good young players. How do you think we get past them in next years playoffs when they get better??? Not to forget the Heat!

Next question? Denver has Melo and A.I. How would Chauncey fit in with those two Divas? Where would A.I. fit in? What about there salary cap?
Im not sure they could even afford #1 a max contract?

Question. If Joe D. could go back and look at sheeds contract and see the production, and the head troubles do you think Joe would sign him to that fat contract again? Typical for NBA contracts is that you pay a fat contract for what the player did in the past with out regards to what he will do for you in the future. My point is do you sign C. Bill to a 4 year max
for 15+Mil. that expires when he's like 35?

[chrisu]

The only person(s) that have to go on the roster are C-Webb - open up a roster spot for a young person to grow. At least defensively, they would be equal to C-Webb...he likes to watch Lebron dunk too much.

The other person that has to go is Saunders. That guys defense stinks. I can accept not shutting down Lebron every game, but what about Igblahblah, and the guy with the hair that looks like the kid from the movie "Holes"... not to mention the rest of the Lebrons...

As much as I was happy to see the sulking, stubborn, selfish Ben Wallace leave, this is the first time all season I can honestly say the Pistons need him. At least all the interior D wouldn't be up to Sheed and Maxiell/Old guys...

As for Chauncey, I think Larry Brown made Billups into the PG he could be, but I think Saunders is letting Billups get soft...the offense is not very discilined either. Too many pull up 3 attempts, not enough movement/passing. Get the Lebrons running on the D end, and man-up on their O. Push bron to his left, cause he is not Michael Jordan and doens't have a left...only right side drives and jumpers.

[MEL]

However, i don't think any of it will happen because they are going win game 6, win this series and beat San Antonio in 6.

Tell me whos your Superbowl pick for this year cause i want to bet against them. Who ever you pick, ill take the other. Thank God we dont have to play the Spurs, they would kill us worse that what the Cavs just did!!!

[Salmonous Maximus]

Here are the changes that are a must:

New coach (Flip Saunders is the biggest pushover coach of all-time...awful)
Webber gone
Sharp shooter off the bench
Re-sign Billiups
Good pick w/15th(?) pick in draft
Joe D. still needs to find a Big man

[Can't Touch This]

Tell me whos your Superbowl pick for this year cause i want to bet against them. Who ever you pick, ill take the other. Thank God we dont have to play the Spurs, they would kill us worse that what the Cavs just did!!!

I honestly didn't think that, but, no one believed in them and i wanted to be the one guy who did, and in case they won, i would have bragging rights...of course, that backfired :lol: . Are you kidding me, they lossed it this series, you could see it in their eyes and body language, they stopped believing they could win, they knew they were beat, they just completly lossed composure..for the FIRST time ever like 3 games in a row.

What they need is a bigtime super star player who wants to win, Garnett, but, we have all been hoping for that for like 10 years.

[M1Garand]

First I will say congrats to the Pistons for making the conference finals 5 years in a row. Now I'll say they need a major overhaul, inc. the coach. When you have the players they do and become only the 3rd team in NBA history to LOSE after going up 2-0 in the conference finals, that is a sign there are problems that need to be addressed. It reminds me of the Yankees when they went up 3-0 on the Red Sox and lost in 7 for only the 3rd time in any major sport, with the other two being hockey. And look where they are now....a roster of all stars and hall of famers and 13 1/2 games behind the Red Sox.

Flip....well he didn't prove me wrong or show me any reason why Minnesota was wrong in letting him go. A good coach but not the one that can take a team all the way. If Rick Carlisle can get canned after putting up two consecutive 50+ game seasons, then I think it's Flips time...he was also a big part of why Ben Wallace left, I don't think it was the money, the Pistons offered him a fair deal and if I remember correctly it wasn't much less than the Bulls offered. I think he would have stayed, but he had issues with Flip. I won't get into who needs to go or stay Joe D I'm sure will figure that out, but I will say Billups (like last year) wasn't there like he should have been, esp for being the "leader". 'Sheed...he needs to learn when to keep his mouth shut, his outbursts are becoming expensive so he should be looked at also. And finally at least I won't have to watch a true great team that is well coached beat them again. They should look at the Spurs playoff run..they adjusted and played arguably a better Suns team and they came at them hard and physical and took them out of their game and the series. The Spurs will show how it's done, how a good team that is well coached handles a one man team. My prediction? Spurs in 4 or 5.

[toto]

I think Rasheed needs to go, too much turmoil, and probably more in the locker room. What they (Pistons) really need is a shooter. Criminy, how many layups can a team miss before you figure out you ain't doing something right?

I'm not one to scream that the officiating was not even, but last nite, I turned the game off after the 1st period. Why? Because it was obvious, to me, that the refs were going to make sure that Cleveland won the game, period. Again, not watching 3 quarters of the game, but I'll just bet that this whole game went like this, breath on LeBron, and get a foul. Am I about right there, and I'll also bet that the same things happened to the Pistons, without much of a foul called. I haven't looked at the stats from last nites game, but someone tell me I'm wrong, but did the Cavs have way more free throw attempts than the Pistons? I would be willing to bet they did. As I said, I turned the game off after the 1st quarter, as it was evident to me, the Pistons were playing 8 on 5, 5 Cavs + 3 refs = 8. Tell me I'm wrong.

[Connor4501]

You start with the coach, plain and simple. There's no discipline on that team. Flip can't get it done in the playoffs, he couldn't get some very talented teams in Minnesota to the promised land and he never will here...

[devo024]

I think you have to make some moves to get younger. It was allmost sad to watch Billups get owned by that rookie from Texas. It would have been even worse trying to stop Tony Parker. I dont know what happened to their D, but they are not good enough to win without playing some. I dont know if Cleveland is really that good, or the Pistons just played that bad. All I know is they better get younger, fast. They need some speed and quickness at the point, and Billups and Hunter are not going to cut it. I love the Pistons, but they need to make some changes. It was a great run while it lasted though.

[TheMAIT]

All the Wings and Pistons had to do was play reasonably well and they should have both made it to the finals with ease....Can you imagine the buzz that would have been going through this town right now?

Now all we have to root for is the Tigers pen not to blow a 4 run lead in the 8th and 9th....we are fairly confident that the starting pitching and hitting can get us into that position most nights.

[GVSUKUSH]

Loose Flip Saunders, Chris Webber, Nazr muhammed, and as much as it hurts me to say, Rasheed Wallace and sign a big name Center/Power Forward like Kevin Garnett and they're competitive again.

But Flip has to go, he's proven that he can win in the Regular season, but he can't win the big postseason game and his coaching was AWFUL in the Cav's series. You still have a fairly young core of guys with Rip, Chauncy, and Prince....build around that, get a decent coach, and you're in the finals again because the eastern conference is WEAK.

[tony_1]

Everybody overlooks the DARKO debacle killed this team. How good would Melo, Bosh, or especially D Wade been in this playoff. Getting to the Confernce Finals 5 straight times, tends to get you off the hook. Plus that would give them a KEY piece to build around in the future.

I think that Joe is going to really look at this team and very possibly try for a sign and trade with Chauncey. He went througt the "end of an era" with the original Bad Boys with that team being held together way too long. That team should've been broken up way earlier that it was. Now this is a perfect chance for Joe to make some changes.

Sign and trade Chauncey, good player hate to see him go but he isn't worth 15 million plus per year. If you can get some decent pieces for him go for it. Atlanta might be interested in someone to guide their young team. They could be the next Chicago. Lots of young talent.

Trade Rasheed, he has limited value but anything. A player, or a draft pick, or a bag of balls anything is better than him and his lack of discipline.

Let Hunter, Webber and Davis ride off into the sunset. They are past their prime, let them go. With Lindsay put him the front office or on the coaching staff.

Flip Murray-he can opt out of his contract, let him go.

Your core is RIP, Tayshaun, Maxiell, Johnson, Delfino, & McDice.

Draft a point guard at #15 (preferably Acie Law) and another big late.

Accept that it is a time to rebuild and go from there. It was a great run while it last. Overall the team overachieved with what they have accomplished. Enjoy it for what it was and hopefully Joe and work some magic and start another it 2-3 years. The eastern conference is weak, but Chicago and Cleveland will both be better than Detroit next year with or with out Chanucey.

[ahasiec]

Do you think that Sheed would have pulled that in Game 6 with Larry Brown coaching??? I don't think so, Flip has no authority on this team, they need a disciplined leader....going back to Baron Davis....does the regualr season really matter, stars and made and born in the playoffs...doesn't look like the #1 seed going into the playoffs is helping the Stones get into the Championship Series does it...In fact, can you even name the last #1 seed to win the NBA title

[pescadero]

You start with the coach, plain and simple. There's no discipline on that team.

I just don't buy that - these guys are professionals. If they need a butt kicking to get discipline, then they need to be shipped out an replaced.

Flip can't get it done in the playoffs, he couldn't get some very talented teams in Minnesota to the promised land and he never will here...

The one year he actually had a very talented team he made the conference finals.

--
lp

[pescadero]

Name a Point guard to replace Chauncy....hmmm...Baron Davis..free agent

You mean the guy who shoots more threes (at a lower percentage) than Chauncey, gets less assists, and averages about 40 games a year missed due to injury... and got his last coach fired? No thanks. One good playoff series doesn't make a great player.

--
lp

[Can't Touch This]

You know, i have never heard more negativity for a team that just reached the conference final, espessially 5 times in a row. Most teams would kill to reach the conference finals, Pistons getting their and losing it is appearently the equivilent to being a lottery team, even though they are 2-3 in the conf finals.

[y2ba]

Name a Point guard to replace Chauncy....hmmm...Baron Davis..free agent

Trade Rip, Maxiell, the 15th Pick in the draft and Dales Davis, expiring contract for Kobe

Ahhh. a point guard who can replace Chauncey? Here it is folks...the next pg for the Detroit Pistons.....Mr. Jason Terry.

[MEL]

You know, i have never heard more negativity for a team that just reached the conference final, espessially 5 times in a row. Most teams would kill to reach the conference finals, Pistons getting their and losing it is appearently the equivilent to being a lottery team, even though they are 2-3 in the conf finals.

Open your eyes dude. Did you watch the playoffs? The Bulls gave us some trouble and the Cavs beat us. These are much younger and hungrier teams. Next year they both should be even better! What are the stones gonna do if both of them get better? Plus the Heat are still out there
and Wade will be back in full form next year. With a little tweak here and there the Heat will again be a factor. The stones could well only be the 4th best team in the East next year!!!
Guess your happy with the play of sheed, Tay, Webber during the playoffs?
Guess your happy with the way Flip Saunders didnt come up with anything to help us win?
Guess your happy with having Webber be starting center next year?
Guess your happy with Sheeds 'tude?
Dude, the writings on the wall. Get better or dont get past the 1st round next year. This is a good team with good players. All it needs is some moves hear and there to improve it for next year?

For the stones its time to keep up or get passed up!!!