tree vs. ground yrdg.

[motowntom48044]

hi all, my son and i have been practicing 20 yrds. on the ground. we now have an opp. to hunt from some tree stands. is it 20 yrds. for base of tree? or do you aim a little high? this is my sons first year and we dont want to wound anything. thanx.

[krt]

Yes. I believe that you use the distance from the base of the tree. I think I've read that most misses are high because it seems that you are farther from your intended target the higher your elevation.

[Chocha]

Best bet is to try and get some elevated practice in... You can speculate aiming high, low or whatever, but the truth is in practing...

For me, my ground vs. treestand was no different at 10, 15 and 25 yards....

Everyone is different tho...

[wyle_e_coyote]

If you trig out the distance, you'd be suprised that it does not change as much as you think when your 20 feet up a tree.
20yrds from the base is only 21.2(ish)yrds along the hypotinose (@ 20 foot up the tree).

[Chocha]

Here is the formula I had put in another post.. Just plug in your applicable numbers... Helps ya to see how close the distance really is...theres been tons of posts on this same topic...



A (squared) + B (squared) = C (squared)

Where:
A = 15ft (height of stand) A (Squared) = 225ft
B = 60ft (distand from base of stand to target) B (Squared) = 3600ft
C = Actual distance from you to the target

So:
A (squared) + B (squared) = C (squared)
225ft + 3600ft = C (squared)
3825ft = C (Squared)

To solve C (Squared ) you take the square root of both sides.

C = 61.8 ft :dizzy:

Sorry I dont have the right sybols to make it easier to read, but that equation would give you the true distances from you to your target provided you have the right info to plug in...

Have fun and happy hunting!!:D

[archerjustin]

In most cases it doesn't make much of a difference to adult hunters who are pulling heavier weight with faster bows. You said this is your son's first year so I'm asuming he's not pulling back 70 lbs. One way you can figure it out is by pacing off distances to certian landmarks for reference from the base of the tree. This is a great way for a youngster to learn to judge distance. Also remember when shooting at a steep incline either up or down requires you to aim a little lower. Do not combine holding low on yardage you paced off from the base of the tree however, that yardage will be true distance. Hope I didn't sound too confusing!

[JacknCoke]

Make sure that you bend at the waist to acquire your target vs. just lowering your arm.

As others have said, the best thing is some practice from the air. If you have anyway to do something safely from even your roof, I would. Even a couple dozen shots will raise your confidence. If my first shot from the air had to be at a live animal, the lack of confidence and nerves would get the best of me.

[walleyeman2006]

this problem came up at deer camp a while back with a freind hunting 20 ft up and shooting only 40 lbs he was shooting such an arch to his arrow flight that he simply had to sight in from his stand and we then marked trees for yardage around his stand.....for young hunters unless you are right with them i strongly recomend to mark yardage so they can see it easily around the stand..........i still do it myself just avoids the range finder all together

[Backwoods-Savage]

There is only one way for you to know; put a target out at 20 yards from the tree, climb into your treestand and shoot a group of arrows dead on at 20 yards. Now it is easy. No change, high or low. But I think you will find that if you aim dead on you will be absolutely correct.

The big reason for shooting from the treestand is that you will find it is a bit different than shooting off of level ground. So climb up, fasten in, shoot.

[dsirrine]

The more practice from elevated positions the better. Shooting from a treestand is ideal. If that isn't an easy option for regular practice, any way to get elevated shots works too - just not as well. But when doing this, try to shoot as you would sitting or standing on your stand (for example, feet close together). Being comfortable safely shooting from above will be more of a factor that the distance is your shooting within 20 feet. Because of where I live, I've had to improvise. I've practiced on very steep hills, off the deck of my house, and I've seen a lot of people practice off their roofs like mentioned above. This also a very good time to emphasize safety. Climbing up and down, possibly when its dark. First time I get up in a tree stand every year is always a little uneasy and my balance is off. This practice will be a great time to talk through everything.

There is a good article in Nov. issue of Wood and Water about buck fever. My first year bow hunting - from the ground - I had 3 does trot in front of me. I was shaking so hard that the arrow barely flew 10 feet before hitting the ground. So, finding a safe way to replicate the shooting conditions "from above" would be my best advice.

Hope it helps - good luck!

[bioactive]

The effect of gravity is an important consideration.

When shooting parallel to the ground, your sights are set so as to compensate for the pull of gravity, the arrow drops toward the ground at exactly the same speed it would if you just dropped it out of your hand.

If you are up in a tree pointing straight down at the ground (90 degrees to a parallel shot), there will be zero affect from gravity in terms of drop from the perspective of the shooter (the arrow will fly slightly faster but it is meaningless as a percentage of the total speed (32 ft. per sec per sec compared to over 300 fps for a modern bow) . Therefore, if you put the sight exactly where you would when shooting from the ground, the arrow will hit higher than you expect it to (from your perspective) with reference to the ground shot.

Snipers know very well that the higher up they are, the less downward effect of gravity, therefore they must aim LOWER than they would at the same distance on the ground.

How much lower you need to aim depends on the angle to the target. As others have said, you need to practice. But every change in angle elicits a different placement. The effect of gravity and distance do offset each other, which is good.

In other words, the arrow drops less from the tree, but the distance is longer. It is the hypotenuse of a triangle drawn from the base of the tree. The distance is the square root of the square roots of the distance up the tree plus the distance from the base of the tree to the target added to each other. (See "the wizard of oz" for the scarecrow's explanation of this). It is fractionally longer than the longest side of the triangle (usually tree to deer unless you climb real high into the tree).

[grandblanc]

not sure if anyone has pointed this out yet, but shooting downhill or uphill (say at 20 yards) your arrow will always hit higher than if you were shooting on level ground. it's the same when shooting with a gun. as the distance you are shooting increases the arrow or bullet will hit higher and higher, so if you are shooting at say 40 yards you should practice from the tree to see if you need to adjust your pin. at 20 yards you probably won't see that much difference. hope his helps.

[SgtSabre]

Generally, the difference between the true range (distance in straight line from shooter to target) and the ballistic range (horizontal distance only) is totally negligable.

As an above poster pointed out, one can use the pythagorean theorum to show the difference between ballistic and true range. I'll skip the hard-to-read-on-a-computer formulas and just post some examples.

Let's say your tree stand is thirty feet high. That's ten yards. The following is true:

Target at 20yds true = 17.32yds ballistic (2.68yds less)

Target at 25yds true = 22.91yds ballistic (2.09yds less)

Target at 30yds true = 28.28yds ballistic (1.72yds less)

Target at 35yds true = 33.54yds ballistic (1.45yds less)

Target at 40yds true = 38.73yds ballistic (1.27yds less)

Does two and a half yards difference in range make a significant impact in shot placement at 20 yards? Probably not so much. Also, as you can see above, as range increases, the difference between true range and ballistic range actually decreases and becomes even more negligable.

Bottom line = don't worry about it one bit.

[Robert Hoover]

i think every one is different such as a short person who is shooting on the ground with the 20 yrd pin their 20urd pin will be closer to the thirty on the sight itself than someone taller whom ,on the ground is shooting more of an angle downward.Hopefullt that makes sense.At camp with this discussion everyone aims about an inch to two lower,this componsates for the angle or the shadowing the deer create just as youd have if you shoot at a side ways target on the ground.hope this makes sense but as far as everyone has said.practice is the only good way to know everyone eyesight is different!

[flags-r-us]

where I live I cant really practice from the ground in my backyard because of too close neighbors. Luckily I can shoot 15 yds indoors at my work, or unlimited distance outside at work. However there is no where practical for me to practice from an elevated stand at my work. To my wife's dismay, I take the screen out of my daughters 2nd floor bedroom window and shoot down into my backyard into my bag. Might look ridiculous to my neighbors but its the only way I can really get some good practice. I also will try to shoot from some really awkward stances, body twisted way right or way left, you never know when that deer may present an unexpected broadside shot from a spot you werent expecting. Also a lot of the time, I'll have does around me when a buck comes in and I'm pretty much stuck in whatever position my body may be in and afraid to move my feet. Now I just need a few more dozen arrows so I can quit going up and down those stairs.