I think my bow is slow. Why?

[SgtSabre]

Setup = Parker Phoenix Outfitter 34", right about 65lbs. w/ 28" draw. Bow is a 2005 model.

String has the following stuff on it: two string leaches, one kisser button, one tied-on D-loop, and one tubeless peep.

Arrow = Carbon Xpress Maxima, total weight 350gr.

Speed is just over 250fps.

Why so slow with such a light arrow? I've read about and have an acquiantance that is getting about 280fps with the same set-up. I've read of other people getting good speed out of these bows with similar set-ups, too.

I'm no speed freak, mind you. I know I don't need mach III speed to kill animals. If my bow is under-performing, though, I wanna know why. Next year I plan to step up to a 400gr arrow for extra penetration and a quieter bow. I worry about dismal trajectory with a heavier arrow.

Why could my bow be so much slower than other bows of the same make/model, and similar set-up?

[StumpJumper]

Are the specs exact? Find out what your brace height and axle to axle is supposed to be and measure it. If it is not in specs it can cause a performance decrease.

[Adam Gibbs]

your brace height could be too high. either that or your bow isnt set at what you think it is.

[fishjunky]

Call Parker. I had same problem they said limbs were bad and they sent me out new ones.Good luck.

[mydogisscout]

added weight on the string slows the string speed

[Kelly Johnson]

Draw weight exactly the same?
That could be a factor.

String stretch and an out of time cam can rob you of speed as well.

[SgtSabre]

I don't know if it could be string stretch. It's been like this out of the box (I bought it brand-new). I'll call Parker and see what they have to say.

[bucksrus]

Let us know what Parker says. I have the same bow (except mine is maxed out at 60 lbs). Also seems a bit slow but I've never had the speed measured. With my old bow I used to be real close whether at 40 yards or 20 yards. Now with this bow I have to aim at the top of a deer 3D target to hit the vitals at 40 yards. Thanks.

[Grouse Hunter]

350 seems on the light side for the maximas that I have seen, did you use a grain scale?

[SgtSabre]

I weighed my arrows on a grain scale.

The Maximas are 8.2 grains per inch. My arrows are 26" long, 26 x 8.2 = 213.2. That + 100gr head = 313.2 grains.

Add insert, knock, and vanes, and 350 sounds about right.

[uptracker]

I'm shooting a Switchback and from what Mathews says, I should be shooting about 318 I think it was. I'm actually shooting 267. Hmmmm.....doesn't bother me though. Speed isn't needed to kill a deer. My buddy shoots 50 lbs. and does pretty well. If Parker can't help much, I wouldn't worry about it too much.

[Grouse Hunter]

I weighed my arrows on a grain scale.

The Maximas are 8.2 grains per inch. My arrows are 26" long, 26 x 8.2 = 213.2. That + 100gr head = 313.2 grains.

Add insert, knock, and vanes, and 350 sounds about right.

YEp that looks right to me. Are you shooting an overdraw?

[Splicer]

if you are looking for your bow to hit the numbers on the box.stop now cause they never do. there is two diffrent numbers for rating bows i think.one always seems high for me.like uptracker i shoot a switchback i hit like 275fps.i never do all the numbers i just go for the vitals:lol:
rick

[Fulldrw]

Take the string leeches and kisser button off the string, get rid of the tube peep and add a G5 peep, that will take a some weight off your string and give you more speed.

[Fulldrw]

I'm shooting a Switchback and from what Mathews says, I should be shooting about 318 I think it was. I'm actually shooting 267. Hmmmm.....doesn't bother me though. Speed isn't needed to kill a deer. My buddy shoots 50 lbs. and does pretty well. If Parker can't help much, I wouldn't worry about it too much.

That 318 is IBO speed. So to shoot 318fps you would have to have a 30" draw, a 350gr arrow, and a 70lb pull. And nothing on the string. Personally, I dont think that a whole lot of people shoot a 30" draw, and probably shouldnt be shooting 70lbs either, I think the average person is 6' or under, thus a 29" or even 28" draw should be the IBO average, and maybe a 65lb pull too. It's more honest for the average shooter, and the current average is misleading.

[uptracker]

I understand that Fulldrw. Just making a point because I should be around that speed. Even when I had nothing on the bow but a rest and a loop, it wouldn't shoot 318.

[insearchof]

I also have a Parker Phoenix and thought it was slow until i did some testing.
The actual feet per second was good compared to other bows.
I had the string stretch and that effected my speed. I called Parker and gave them a few measurements and they sent me a new string.
I am very ahppy with my bow, its speed and Parkers Service.
Matt

[GVDocHoliday]

Well...first off 28" draw length, 25 grains over IBO...and a buttload of stuff on the string. Nothing slows an arrow down like junk on the string. All you need is a peep and a dloop...get rid of that kisser (at least 10fps there), and the string leaches. Make sure the cam is in the optimum positition and you should pick up at least 15fps. However the Pheonix models are not rated very fast so 250 seems very good.

[SgtSabre]

An update:

As I was on-stand recently I noticed that the draw-length module in the cam is chewing away at the serving on the string. There is no serving left where the "sharpest" part of the draw-length module contacts the string. It's now probably going to start chewing on the string itself http://www.archerytalk.com/vb/images/smilies/eek.gif

Also, if I hold the bow vertically and look at the alignment of the string to the cam, I can see that the cam is torqued slightly. That is, the cam is "leaning" to the left slightly when viewed from the rear.

This can't be normal, can it? I've called Parker and they've told me to send it in. They said I'd have it back within about ten business days from the time it was shipped. Nice!!

I've heard that Parker really takes care of customers, and so far I'm not dissappointed. They also said that my 250fps with a 350gr arrow seems a little slow, even considering my draw length and 65lb pull. They told me that they will take care of the string and cable, which is probably stretched, as well as the apparent problem with the cam bushing. They said they may even go ahead and upgrade the cam and idler bushing system to the new ball-bearing system for no charge :D .

[lumpy]

my buddy is the michigan parker rep and if you have a problem PARKER will stand behind it 100%, that is why I like them . No questions asked , Hunted North Dakota last year with a buddy that had a bow issue in transit (parker Pheonix) , called PARKER and they they said where are you at , gave us directions to a local dealer and they worked on the bow for 1/2 hour replaced a cam module , set on a new string and said "there you go, Parker will pick up the bill" . Now that is service.

[SgtSabre]

Sent. I'll keep this thread updated for anybody who may be interested in Parker's customer service.

[Oct.1]

Hope you do,
I only used Parker Service once. I called, and the President of the company answered the phone. I told him that I broke a part and wanted to purchase a new one. Remember I broke it, nothing that didn’t last the warranty period, I broke it.
It took about 3 days and I received two not one but two with a letter saying incase you break another one.
No charge not even shipping and handling.
I hope for you their service is still as good.

[MuskyDan]

I have sold a few Parkers and that speed really doesn't sound all that bad. Assuming you are losing 10 to 25 FPS with each inch of decreased draw length along with the stuff in the string and I would bet you should be right in there somewhere!!!

[SgtSabre]

I have sold a few Parkers and that speed really doesn't sound all that bad. Assuming you are losing 10 to 25 FPS with each inch of decreased draw length along with the stuff in the string and I would bet you should be right in there somewhere!!!

If that's the case, and the bow is performing the way it should and still only getting 250fps with a 350gr arrow, that's fine. I just want the bow to perform up to its potential.

It's not like I'm lacking on penetration: I just killed my second doe this year. 40yds, quartering away, facing to my left. She jumped the string (really, really, really jumped it) and ducked and whirled around on the shot. The arrow caught her mid-whirl in the back of the neck at the base of the skull. I went from :) to :yikes: . She went down like a lead balloon. Upon inspection, the 100gr Muzzy three-blade had penetrated fully through one vertabra and exited the throat area.

Not the shot placement I was hoping for, but at least she went down quick. That light arrow going slow (by today's standards) sure did the job just fine.

[MuskyDan]

max the bow to 70 and shoot it thru the chrono and I would guess you'll get about 262-265. Then add 15 foot per second per inch of drawlength to 30"es. Thats 295, lose the kisser and peep and your up over 300 I think the bow is doing exactly what it is supposed to. Nice work on the doe congrats.

[bivenser]

My bow shop out here has calculators on their web site that will help you see what the changes in arrow weight, draw length and pull weight do to the speed based on the IBO speed of your bow. How it helps

http://www.thearcheryhut.com/calculators.php

[TnRidge]

Speed sells bows , a quiet, forgiving bow kills more deer .;)

[SgtSabre]

The bow was delivered Monday. Today (Tuesday morning) I got a call from the technician who originally built the bow. He told me that the following had been done:

1. New limbs installed. He said sometimes they get a "weak" set for some reason. Confirmed that it maxing out at 65lbs before. He's now measured it at 73lbs which he says should mellow out to right around 70lbs when the string and cable stretch a bit.

2. New string and cable

3. Brand new cam, slightly more aggressive than old cam

4. Upgraded cam and idler bushings to Parker's new EXT ball-bearing system

So, let's think about this: New cam (idler too, maybe?), new string, new cable, new limbs. So other than the riser, I now have a brand-new bow.

He says it will ship out today. :D

[Oct.1]

Any charge?

[lumpy]

That's why I love parker's.

I have always looked at the company and said " they do not spend alot on advertising, and the likes , but just make a great bow that is backed up by a company that is owned by hunters that work for hunters".

Merry Christmas Sgt.

[SgtSabre]

Any charge?

Zero charge from Parker. Total cost for Priority Mail with delivery confirmation and $700 of insurance was $26.90. Also, they didn't transfer my kisser button or D-loop from the old string to the new. So that's another few dollars for a shop to do it. All in all, pretty reasonable for an almost-completely-brand-new bow, huh?

[hawk4932]

Thats outstanding. With customer service like that I may think about a Parker when it comes time for a new bow. From everything that I have read here I would say they rank up there with the best. Congrats on your new components thats awesome. You'll be back in business for the late archery season. :)

[Oct.1]

Let us know when you get it back if all the work seemed to correct the problem?
I'm glad to hear they are still honoring their warrantee so well.
I haven't had to use them for problems yet except for the one problem I caused.
By the way I broke the cable guide forcing it off the bow without relaxing the limbs. No biggy but the courtesy I received over the phone and the speed of shipment was fantastic.
No I don't work for Parker just own one.

[SgtSabre]

Got it back today (November 16th)

The Cam: It's appears to me to be significantly more elongated than the old cam. The old one was very round compared to competitor's bows. I like it.

The Limbs / Draw Weight: Wow, it's amazing what eight more pounds can do. I could draw it at 65 all day. Now at 73, I still can, but if feels a lot heavier. New limbs also have a different version of Sims' Limbsaver. The old one was circular, this new one has two semi-circular cut-outs opposite each other on it.

In summary: The bow was sent on November 10th, delivery confirmation indicates it was delivered at 3pm on November 13th. At 9:30am on the next day, I got a call from Parker saying that it's done and notifying me of the work performed. They said it would ship out that evening. (That's a 24hr turn-around time!!). November 16th, it's at my door. Total down time: six days.

Nice :D