Do you think the Muslims are over reacting?

[Huntsman27]

Ive about had enough of those idiots. A few cartoons and they figure thats a reason to go wilding? The world had better wake up with all the crap they are demanding, Sharia law instead of laws of the countries they inhabit. Iam with Australia, if they dont like the law of the land get out.........pretty simple.

[Bwana]

Ive about had enough of those idiots. A few cartoons and they figure thats a reason to go wilding? The world had better wake up with all the crap they are demanding, Sharia law instead of laws of the countries they inhabit. Iam with Australia, if they dont like the law of the land get out.........pretty simple.

In a word yes. They are behaving irrationally in the name of faith when in fact it is due to extreme ignorance. If the leaders of those countries worried as much about educating their population as they did about teaching them to hate the "zionists', this crap wouldn't happen nearly as much. Many thought I was a little nuts/extreme about my opinion that we are on the eve of a major conflict. In my opinion, this moves us even closer. They are going to try and turn this into a "Crusade" issue if the Iranian Nuclear Reactors are hit....and it looks like Denmark has provided them with some "proof" (re: propaganda).

It sounds like Australia has their position correct. Too bad us Americans try to be politically correct to do the same. How many sucide bombers/terrosist attacks will we have to suffer in the name of political correctness and diversity?

[fish eater]

Yes. Way out of proportion.:dizzy::(

[dtg]

It's amazing how they don't react when innocent civilians get beheaded, but a cartoon comes out and they go bonkers. I've had enough of it, I wouldn't feel bad at all if that whole region got turned into the worlds largest piece of glass!!!! I've had enough of the rock chuckers mentality. So I guess now, nobody can do anything that may offend them in any country, it's absurd, its time we put them back to dust and be done with it.

I know I'll catch flak for these statements, but enough already, we know you intend to kill all of us that aren't Muslim, so off to Allah with you first.

[Brian S]

Hmmmm, their reaction seems a bit extreme, but then, I haven't seen the cartoon so I shouldn't rush to make judgement.

So, where is that cartoon? :16suspect . . . can't seem to find a copy anywhere . . . you'd think it would be in the news . . .

[lkmifisherman]

I agree 100% huntsman...Don't immagrate to my country and then tell me that my Constitution is a living document to be changed and amended at their whim. If you don't like it get to he!! out!!!! The crap that they are pulling now with all the violence over some stupid cartoon is inseine. What we happen if we did that over evey cartoon ever done about Jesus? They would have already been annihilated...

lkmifisherman

[Ranger Ray]

Hey, hey now be nice. You know they may not have evolved as far from the wild animal within themselves as we Americans. You know its what monkey genes we where all blessed with that made us what we are today. They are just displaying the animal within themselves.
http://www.solcomhouse.com/affeape.gif

[Huntsman27]

In a word yes. They are behaving irrationally in the name of faith when in fact it is due to extreme ignorance. If the leaders of those countries worried as much about educating their population as they did about teaching them to hate the "zionists', this crap wouldn't happen nearly as much. Many thought I was a little nuts/extreme about my opinion that we are on the eve of a major conflict. In my opinion, this moves us even closer. They are going to try and turn this into a "Crusade" issue if the Iranian Nuclear Reactors are hit....and it looks like Denmark has provided them with some "proof" (re: propaganda).

It sounds like Australia has their position correct. Too bad us Americans try to be politically correct to do the same. How many sucide bombers/terrosist attacks will we have to suffer in the name of political correctness and diversity?
Almost everywhere they have cried Sharia law [not the law of the land] and tried to make the host country turn to their laws/customs. Many dont realize the fanatic Muslims will push this to the limit. Much like the push until Polish King John3 defeated Islamist Kara Mustafa in Vienna in 1683.
Pay heed to the past.

[Kevin]

"We are protesting portrayals of us as irrational and violent, by being irrational and violent"

[victor mi pro bowhunter]

There not over-reacting, there just looking for a reason!!!!!!!!
:yeahthat: If you think about it.
It makes the most since

[PencilPlugger]

Obviously it's an overreaction but I think it's due to the fact that they think their religion is under attack. If any of the other major religions were under the same pressures, then there might be similar reactions.

[Bwana]

Obviously it's an overreaction but I think it's due to the fact that they think their religion is under attack. If any of the other major religions were under the same pressures, then there might be similar reactions.

The last time I checked the other major religions were not advocating driving passenger planes into Skyscrapers or encouraging their followers to remove Israel from the map!

[dtg]

The last time I checked the other major religions were not advocating driving passenger planes into Skyscrapers or encouraging their followers to remove Israel from the map!
You left out beheading infidels and blowing themselves up!!!!!

[PencilPlugger]

The last time I checked the other major religions were not advocating driving passenger planes into Skyscrapers or encouraging their followers to remove Israel from the map!
The radicals haven't hijacked those religions to the same degree (yet).

[victor mi pro bowhunter]

The last time I checked the other major religions were not advocating driving passenger planes into Skyscrapers or encouraging their followers to remove Israel from the map!
I really dont think there religion has to do with it they are not well informed.
With most religions they got people who study it year after year and put it in words that make since because lets face it reading the bible is like reading some thing in pig latin.Thats why it has been broke down in simple terms.like it says this but what it means is this.
with there religon there is not as many people who study it so its hard for them to really understand it.it dont say any where in it that if you kill your self buy atacking america then you will get (seven/six I dont know) virgins in heaven.
But there leaders the one who really deserve all this hate is to blame they will tell there soldiers.that by doing this you will get reworded and your famly to.
they belive its a honor to die for there religion even if they dont know much about it.In ww2 japan used suicide planes but they did it for there country they beleved it was a honor.ITS THE LEADERS NOT THE PEOPLE

[upnut]

Here's a link where you can view those offensive cartoons: http://www.michellemalkin.com/

Just keep scrolling down...

Do we really believe these are spontaneous demonstrations? The cartoons were first published last October...Apparently it takes a little time to whip up spontaneous demonstrations...

Where did all those Danish flags come from that we see being torched? Apparently there are alot more foreign flags laying around than I realized...

As we see so many bastions of free speech kow-tow to the Islamofascists, does it seem like the bad guys are winning on this one?....Scott B.

[WILDCATWICK]

Idiots. Pure and simple. These people have to be from another planet, Spock would say "that's not logical Jim".

I've seen the editor for that paper speak several times now. On one occassion he nailed it. He would not tell Muslims how to worship and to press his views on him & he thinks that the Muslims should not tell him how to publish and to push their views in another society.

He also said he will publish all the cartoons that will be in the Iranian contest. I don't know why he would do that, but that's what he said.

[Sib]

Yeah, they're a bunch of nutballs in that part of the world. Their govts. are the ones behind the protests and their rationale is quite flawed for the response. They reason they are rioting is because they say that image of mohammad cannot be shown. But that is really a bunch of BS, because as this link shows, muslims have been drawing/painting the image of mohammad for centuries.

http://www.zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive

What you have is the govt. of these countries fomenting the violence. The reason the govts of these countries do this is so the people on the street can focus their anger and frustration and villianize the west. The last thing these govts want is the people in their country looking at their living conditions and asking why they are stuck where they are, while their kings and mullahs live like playboys.

Also, it's quite hypocritical of the muslims to be upset on this issue considering they're the number one producers of blood liable on this planet, publishing articles regularly in their papers with bold face lies, like rabbi's drinking blood, etc.

Whacked out people that earned their lot in life. Hopefully someday they can elevate their beliefs and join the human race.

[tenring]

What you have is the govt. of these countries fomenting the violence. The reason the govts of these countries do this is so the people on the street can focus their anger and frustration and villianize the west. The last thing these govts want is the people in their country looking at their living conditions and asking why they are stuck where they are, while their kings and mullahs live like playboys.

That sounds on the money. Yeah they over-reacted. A repsonse or two here, made one or two of you sound like quite the reactionary types yourself. I am not sure what was in the cartoon, but you know these fundamentalist extremists types blow their top at this sort of stuff and it seems like the stuff was printed just to piss them off. I don't get it. I don't see any upside to printing this stuff. Its not going to provoke thought with the fundamentalists. Then other papers or whatever continue to re publish the thing in the various countries. At that point, it would seem like everyone is piling on and if you are some fundamentalist, you are probably gonna get more pissed. I just don't see the logic or the point of the cartoon, other than just shaking up a bee hive.

[Sib]

They say that more wars have been fought, and more people killed in the name of christianity than any other reason, looks like history is getting ready to repeat its self

I think if they had replaced the word christianity with the word religion, they'd be correct. That's what this agnostic thinks, anyway.

[Bulletproof]

The reaction was completly unjustified and wrong. On the side of the news papers printing this is the argument of can vs. should. An issue like this was not culturally sensitive and probably shouldn't have been printed. The culture is different way different. Would Christians or Jews react this way?

[Huntsman27]

The reaction was completly unjustified and wrong. On the side of the news papers printing this is the argument of can vs. should. An issue like this was not culturally sensitive and probably shouldn't have been printed. The culture is different way different. Would Christians or Jews react this way?
They would certainly say its wrong, but would not be calling for beheadings, and death over a cartoon. Syria and Iran are the ringleaders trying to stir up trouble [doing a decent job of it also]. Irans President is among the fools we are going to have to deal with sooner than later. [Korea, being another trouble spot, but not related to Islam].

[Ranger Ray]

They say that more wars have been fought, and more people killed in the name of christianity than any other reason, looks like history is getting ready to repeat its self
More like prophesy is about to be fulfilled. ;)

[eddiejohn4]

They have been publishing degrading articles and pictures about christians and jews for decades,but want respect for Muhammed.This is not about cartoons this is gearing up the radical muslims for Jihad.These radicals will not be happy untill this is an all out confrontation.And I for one believe they should get what they want.This is a backward culture that thinks they can dictate what the rest of the world does,by threats and intimidation.We need to send them a strong message that this will not be tolerated.

[dtg]

We need to send them a strong message that this will not be tolerated.
....like a beautiful ginormous mushroom shaped cloud:lol: :lol:

[Nu_2_MI]

Over reacting? Yes. Are all Muslims whck jobs? No. What we are seeing represents only a small portion of those who practice the religion. If you do some real reading and not just the interpretations of those who do not practice it, then you might get the impression that it is the religion causing all this not just some of the leaders who use religion to further their own political agenda....sounds like someone else...but I will leave that for a further discusiion...LOL.

Anyway....this all goes back to Osama Bin Laden. Last week or so, Osama came out and had ordered a cultural war. Not long after that, this stuff came out. Remember...these cartoons were placed in these papers back...oj...I think in September October. This is just a tactical ploy. He calls for a culutral war and then this..well guess what...he now has one of the best recruitment tools ever. We should have taken this guy out when we had a chance .....yes...I am referring to the Clinton years and more recently the Bush's fumble in Afghanistan. This guy is still a real threat. when he ha can still have this kind of influence...it's scary. We need to make a renewed effort to find this guy and off him. It is far easier to take he head of the snake than to keep nipping at it's tail. This guy has always been far more of a threat to our country than Sadam ever was.

[frenchriver1]

Don't immagrate to my country and then tell me that my Constitution is a living document to be changed and amended at their whim.

lkmifisherman

I'm not at all supporting the actions of late but your statement is of interest since we invaded tha little country over there and have forced our govermental ways upon the people there, new constitution, elections, etc. I don't know if any supreme ruling that democracy is the best form of government for any coutry, but we seem hell bent on making it stick in Saddam's former land, in the face of the deep religious divisions that go back centuries in that area...

[Sib]

A few extremists, or a culture of violence? I guess that's a matter of perspective.

In recent days, crowds of thousands have gathered throughout the Muslim world—burning European embassies, issuing threats, and even taking hostages—in protest over 12 cartoons depicting the Prophet Muhammad that were first published in a Danish newspaper last September. The problem is not merely that the cartoons were mildly derogatory. The furor primarily erupted over the fact that the Prophet had been depicted at all. Muslims consider any physical rendering of Muhammad to be an act of idolatry. And idolatry is punishable by death. Criticism of Muhammad or his teaching—which was also implicit in the cartoons—is considered blasphemy. As it turns out, blasphemy is also punishable by death. So pious Muslims have two reasons to “not accept less than a severing of the heads of those responsible,” as was recently elucidated by a preacher at the Al Omari mosque in Gaza.

The religious hysteria has not been confined to the “extremists” of the Muslim world. Seventeen Arab governments issued a joint statement of protest, calling for the punishment of those responsible. Pakistan’s parliament unanimously condemned the drawings as a “vicious, outrageous and provocative campaign” that has “hurt the faith and feelings of Muslims all over the world.” Turkey’s prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, while still seeking his nation’s entry into the European Union, nevertheless declared that the cartoons were an attack upon the “spiritual values” of Muslims everywhere. The leader of Lebanon’s governing Hezbollah faction observed that the whole episode could have been avoided if only the novelist Salman Rushdie had been properly slaughtered for writing “The Satanic Verses.”

Let us take stock of the moral intuitions now on display in the House of Islam: On Aug. 17, 2005, an Iraqi insurgent helped collect the injured survivors of a car bombing, rushed them to a hospital and then detonated his own bomb, murdering those who were already mortally wounded as well as the doctors and nurses struggling to save their lives. Where were the cries of outrage from the Muslim world? Religious sociopaths kill innocents by the hundreds in the capitols of Europe, blow up the offices of the U.N. and the Red Cross, purposefully annihilate crowds of children gathered to collect candy from U.S. soldiers on the streets of Baghdad, kidnap journalists, behead them, and the videos of their butchery become the most popular form of pornography in the Muslim world, and no one utters a word of protest because these atrocities have been perpetrated “in defense of Islam.” But draw a picture of the Prophet, and pious mobs convulse with pious rage. One could hardly ask for a better example of religious dogmatism and its pseudo-morality eclipsing basic, human goodness.

It is time we recognized—and obliged the Muslim world to recognize—that “Muslim extremism” is not extreme among Muslims. Mainstream Islam itself represents an extremist rejection of intellectual honesty, gender equality, secular politics and genuine pluralism. The truth about Islam is as politically incorrect as it is terrifying: Islam is all fringe and no center. In Islam, we confront a civilization with an arrested history. It is as though a portal in time has opened, and the Christians of the 14th century are pouring into our world.

Islam is the fastest growing religion in Europe. The demographic trends are ominous: Given current birthrates, France could be a majority Muslim country in 25 years, and that is if immigration were to stop tomorrow. Throughout Western Europe, Muslim immigrants show little inclination to acquire the secular and civil values of their host countries, and yet exploit these values to the utmost—demanding tolerance for their backwardness, their misogyny, their anti-Semitism, and the genocidal hatred that is regularly preached in their mosques. Political correctness and fears of racism have rendered many secular Europeans incapable of opposing the terrifying religious commitments of the extremists in their midst. In an effort to appease the lunatic furor arising in the Muslim world in response to the publication of the Danish cartoons, many Western leaders have offered apologies for exercising the very freedoms that are constitutive of civil society in the 21st century. The U.S. and British governments have chastised Denmark and the other countries that published the cartoons for privileging freedom of speech over religious sensitivity. It is not often that one sees the most powerful countries on Earth achieve new depths of weakness, moral exhaustion and geopolitical stupidity with a single gesture. This was appeasement at its most abject.

The idea that Islam is a “peaceful religion hijacked by extremists” is a dangerous fantasy—and it is now a particularly dangerous fantasy for Muslims to indulge. It is not at all clear how we should proceed in our dialogue with the Muslim world, but deluding ourselves with euphemisms is not the answer. It now appears to be a truism in foreign policy circles that real reform in the Muslim world cannot be imposed from the outside. But it is important to recognize why this is so—it is so because the Muslim world is utterly deranged by its religious tribalism. In confronting the religious literalism and ignorance of the Muslim world, we must appreciate how terrifyingly isolated Muslims have become in intellectual terms. The problem is especially acute in the Arab world. Consider: According to the United Nations’ Arab Human Development Reports, less than 2% of Arabs have access to the Internet. Arabs represent 5% of the world’s population and yet produce only 1% of the world’s books, most of them religious. In fact, Spain translates more books into Spanish each year than the entire Arab world has translated into Arabic since the ninth century.

Our press should report on the terrifying state of discourse in the Arab press, exposing the degree to which it is a tissue of lies, conspiracy theories and exhortations to recapture the glories of the seventh century. All civilized nations must unite in condemnation of a theology that now threatens to destabilize much of the Earth. Muslim moderates, wherever they are, must be given every tool necessary to win a war of ideas with their coreligionists. Otherwise, we will have to win some very terrible wars in the future. It is time we realized that the endgame for civilization is not political correctness. It is not respect for the abject religious certainties of the mob. It is reason.

Sam Harris is the author of “The End of Faith: Religion, Terror, and the Future of Reason” (W.W. Norton). He can be reached through his website at www.samharris.org.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20060207_reality_islam/

[DaveW731]

[QUOTE=Sib]A few extremists, or a culture of violence? I guess that's a matter of perspective.

.... In Islam, we confront a civilization with an arrested history. It is as though a portal in time has opened, and the Christians of the 14th century are pouring into our world......Our press should report on the terrifying state of discourse in the Arab press, exposing the degree to which it is a tissue of lies, conspiracy theories and exhortations to recapture the glories of the seventh century. ...Muslim moderates, wherever they are, must be given every tool necessary to win a war of ideas with their coreligionists. Otherwise, we will have to win some very terrible wars in the future. It is time we realized that the endgame for civilization is not political correctness. It is not respect for the abject religious certainties of the mob. It is reason.

[QUOTE]

It is indeed striking to listen to the rhetoric from the Muslim world, and compare it to the rhetoric used in Europe to justify the Crusades. If there truly ARE "Muslim moderates" in any position of influence, they seem strangely silent at the most crucial times. The prospect of a 14th (Or I would say 11th) century worldview with 21st century weapons is frightening indeed and it may be too late to stop another "Holy" war.
On the other hand, one of the best things that happened to Europe in the 11th century was to be ultimately defeated by Saladin and be unable to hold Jerusalem. As a result, returning Europeans brought back with them knowledge from what was at the time a far more advanced civilization and learned a few things (like algebra) that helped Europe move out of the dark ages. May the Muslim world (peace be upon it), through similar means, make similar strides....it would make the world a better place.

[WILDCATWICK]

Muslim moderates, wherever they are, must be given every tool necessary to win a war of ideas with their coreligionists. Otherwise, we will have to win some very terrible wars in the future. It is time we realized that the endgame for civilization is not political correctness.

Yep. With such a large population it's amazing how we are rarely hearing anything from them. The leaders of the moderate Muslim world need to get organized and start wageing war against the extreamist in their own religion. The longer they are not heard the more people who will become opposed to their religion as a whole. Living in Michigan I'm absolutly have been shocked that the large muslim community here has not done large marches and other events to get press time and show others that they are opposed to the non-sense that is being brought forth by the extreamist.

[dtg]

Yep. With such a large population it's amazing how we are rarely hearing anything from them. The leaders of the moderate Muslim world need to get organized and start wageing war against the extreamist in their own religion. The longer they are not heard the more people who will become opposed to their religion as a whole. Living in Michigan I'm absolutly have been shocked that the large muslim community here has not done large marches and other events to get press time and show others that they are opposed to the non-sense that is being brought forth by the extreamist.
The reasons I hear, are that the Moderates are scared of what the extremists will do if they speak up. Remember the Auther of that book "The Satanic Verses" They still have him on the hit list. Once they speak up, they'll be classified just like the rest of us and ripe for extermination. Personally, it makes me very nervous that nobody is very outspoken about the madness. In my book to sit back and say and do nothing is just as bad as the ones that are off the wall and doing all these horrible things. I understand the fear, but you have to do the right thing and not let the Insane rule the religion.

The only thing that the Extremist know is brute force. When we cut and ran in Somalia, that just fueled the problem. The leaders saw that with a small body count, the ALL Powerful Americans will cut and run. That allowed the numbers and fearlessness in the region to grow. Now that we are in their backyard, they are going to fight with all their might because they know that if they lose, they are done for. They rule through terror.

[Nu_2_MI]

There are plenty of moderates calling for peace. In fact Danish Muslims have denounced the violence by saying that Islam speaks out against violence. we have heard that repeated time and time again. If you were to do a google search and put in "Muslims call for peace", I think you might be surprised.

It is very similar to hardcore Christians who call for the death of those who work at Planned Parenthood locations. Granted they aren't getting as riled up..but there have certainly been murders and bombings.

Again, I am in no way saying that these peole are right. .....clearly they are nuts, but we must sociologically look into why these things are going on.

I still contend that this was a militaristic ploy by Bin Laden to rouse his base for a renewed effort of terrorist attacks across the globe. We should have nailed him when we had the chance...twice.....Clinton and Bush.

BTW...I am curious as to where you are hearing that they are afraid to speak out.

[Ranger Ray]

Well there is certainly no one with power to change anything in the Muslim countries doing anything about the radicalism that is arising. There is no one holding power in the middle east that is strong enough to stop it. Matter of fact most weak leaders are becoming cheerleaders so to stay in power. Not to hard to make claim that radicals are becoming more in charge over there, just look at who has become the head of Iran and Palestine.

[WILDCATWICK]

There are plenty of moderates calling for peace. In fact Danish Muslims have denounced the violence by saying that Islam speaks out against violence. we have heard that repeated time and time again. If you were to do a google search and put in "Muslims call for peace", I think you might be surprised.


Sure they are but I haven't heard any. If I have to do a google search in order to hear then they are falling way short on their efforts. They need to start stepping it up and come up with some sort of campaign to truely condem it in a more visible way or they risk backlash from the general public by assosciation.

[Ogre]

There are plenty of moderates calling for peace. In fact Danish Muslims have denounced the violence by saying that Islam speaks out against violence. we have heard that repeated time and time again.

They over reacted. There is no moral equivalency between the act and the reactions to the act.

On the subject of the above quote, this is only half right. Danish Muslims have deplored the acts after the fact but they started the fracas. They accumulated the cartoons, even ones that were never published, and months after the cartoons were published they then decimated the assembled cartoons to the middle east. Yes, from what I have heard the unpublished cartoons were raw. This is exactly why the unpublished cartoons were unpublished.

[Jigawhat]

> CALVIN AND HOBBES -- AND MUHAMMAD
>
> By Ann Coulter Wed Feb 8, 8:16 PM ET
>
> As my regular readers know, I've long been skeptical of the "Religion
> of Peace" moniker for Muslims -- for at least 3,000 reasons right off
> the top of my head. I think the evidence is going my way this week.
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
> The culture editor of a newspaper in Denmark suspected writers and
> cartoonists were engaging in self-censorship when it came to the
> Religion of Peace. It was subtle things, like a Danish comedian's
> statement, paraphrased by The New York Times, "that he had no problem
> urinating on the Bible but that he would not dare do the same to the Quran."
>
> So, after verifying that his life insurance premiums were paid up, the
> editor expressly requested cartoons of Muhammad from every cartoonist
> with a Danish cartoon syndicate. Out of 40 cartoonists, only 10
> accepted the invitation, most of them submitting utterly neutral
> drawings with no political content whatsoever.
>
> But three cartoons made political points.
>
> One showed Muhammad turning away suicide bombers from the gates of
> heaven, saying "Stop, stop -- we ran out of virgins!" -- which I
> believe was a commentary on Muslims' predilection for violence.
> Another was a cartoon of Muhammad with horns, which I believe was a commentary on Muslims'
> predilection for violence. The third showed Muhammad with a turban in
> the shape of a bomb, which I believe was an expression of
> post-industrial ennui in a secular -- oops, no, wait: It was more of a
> commentary on Muslims' predilection for violence.
>
> In order to express their displeasure with the idea that Muslims are
> violent, thousands of Muslims around the world engaged in rioting,
> arson, mob savagery, flag-burning, murder and mayhem, among other
> peaceful acts of nonviolence.
>
> Muslims are the only people who make feminists seem laid-back.
>
> The little darlings brandish placards with typical Religion of Peace
> slogans, such as: "Behead Those Who Insult Islam," "Europe, you will
> pay, extermination is on the way" and "Butcher those who mock Islam."
> They warn Europe of their own impending 9/11 with signs that say:
> "Europe: Your 9/11 will come" -- which is ironic, because they almost
> had me convinced the Jews were behind the 9/11 attack.
>
> The rioting Muslims claim they are upset because Islam prohibits any
> depictions of Muhammad -- though the text is ambiguous on beheadings,
> suicide bombings and flying planes into skyscrapers.
>
> The belief that Islam forbids portrayals of Muhammad is recently acquired.
> Back when Muslims created things, rather than blowing them up, they
> made paintings, frescoes, miniatures and prints of Muhammad.
>
> But apparently the Quran is like the Constitution: It's a "living
> document," capable of sprouting all-new provisions at will. Muslims
> ought to start claiming the Quran also prohibits indoor plumbing, to
> explain their lack of it.
>
> Other interpretations of the Quran forbid images of humans or animals,
> which makes even a child's coloring book blasphemous. That's why the
> Taliban blew up those priceless Buddhist statues, bless their
> innocent, peace-loving little hearts.
>
> Largely unnoticed in this spectacle is the blinding fact that one
> nation is missing from the long list of Muslim countries (by which I
> mean France and England) with hundreds of crazy Muslims experiencing
> bipolar rage over some cartoons:
> Iraq. Hey -- maybe this democracy thing does work! The barbaric
> behavior of Europe's Muslims suggests that the European welfare state
> may not be attracting your top-notch Muslims.
>
> Making the rash assumption for purposes of discussion that Islam is a
> religion and not a car-burning cult, even a real religion can't go
> bossing around other people like this.
>
> Catholics aren't short on rules, but they couldn't care less if
> non-Catholics use birth control. Conservative Jews have no interest in
> forbidding other people from mixing meat and dairy. Protestants don't
> make a peep about other people eating food off one another's plates.
> (Just stay away from our plates -- that's disgusting.)
>
> But Muslims think they can issue decrees about what images can appear
> in newspaper cartoons. Who do they think they are, liberals?

[DaveW731]

There are plenty of moderates calling for peace. In fact Danish Muslims have denounced the violence by saying that Islam speaks out against violence. we have heard that repeated time and time again. If you were to do a google search and put in "Muslims call for peace", I think you might be surprised.

It is very similar to hardcore Christians who call for the death of those who work at Planned Parenthood locations. Granted they aren't getting as riled up..but there have certainly been murders and bombings.

Again, I am in no way saying that these peole are right. .....clearly they are nuts, but we must sociologically look into why these things are going on.

I still contend that this was a militaristic ploy by Bin Laden to rouse his base for a renewed effort of terrorist attacks across the globe. We should have nailed him when we had the chance...twice.....Clinton and Bush.

BTW...I am curious as to where you are hearing that they are afraid to speak out.

To my Southern, former O-lineman, somewhat liberal, gotta-learn-to-not-be-afraid-of-ice friend:
We HAVE to stop meeting like this:lol: :lol:
In terms of where I hear that they are afraid to speak out, I don't know of the exact causes for the comparative lack of speaking out, I simply observe it. Your Google search suggestion is worth taking, however by comparison all you have to do is have the radio or TV on, or read a newspaper, to see the violent side. Could this be journalistic bias?
As far as the sociological point goes, one book that I found that makes that attempt is Terror in the Mind of God. An interesting read, it examines terrorism across different religions, ranging from Northern Ireland to Japan.
Finally, I DO AGREE with you, about screwing up when we failed to get the Son of a Laden when we had the chance.

[Nu_2_MI]

They over reacted. There is no moral equivalency between the act and the reactions to the act.

On the subject of the above quote, this is only half right. Danish Muslims have deplored the acts after the fact but they started the fracas. They accumulated the cartoons, even ones that were never published, and months after the cartoons were published they then decimated the assembled cartoons to the middle east. Yes, from what I have heard the unpublished cartoons were raw. This is exactly why the unpublished cartoons were unpublished.


REally? Prove it. The Danish Muslims started peaceful protests. Want to know the reason they protested mostly... the paper that printed these was incredibly anti-immigrant and had launched many worded attaacks against letting anymore legal immigrants into the country. There had been many, many articles and cartoons which attacked the Muslims....and Africans. So the Danish people protested.

Why would the Danes wait months before they sent the cartoons out? It was UBL who used this as a ploy to rally his base.

[Nu_2_MI]

To my Southern, former O-lineman, somewhat liberal, gotta-learn-to-not-be-afraid-of-ice friend:
We HAVE to stop meeting like this:lol: :lol:
In terms of where I hear that they are afraid to speak out, I don't know of the exact causes for the comparative lack of speaking out, I simply observe it. Your Google search suggestion is worth taking, however by comparison all you have to do is have the radio or TV on, or read a newspaper, to see the violent side. Could this be journalistic bias?
As far as the sociological point goes, one book that I found that makes that attempt is Terror in the Mind of God. An interesting read, it examines terrorism across different religions, ranging from Northern Ireland to Japan.
Finally, I DO AGREE with you, about screwing up when we failed to get the Son of a Laden when we had the chance.

As far as being afraid of the ice.....you got me there...but I am willing to learn.(hint hint) but you can bet I'll be a spudding fool(see...I've learned a little from this board..LOL).

I will head to the library and look that up. I can always appreciate reading different points of view. I agree that we do not see the non-violent protests on tv nor do we hear it on the radio, but as you pointed out, it is possible, in fact very likely, that this does not make for good ratings. What is better for the news.....Molatov cocktails flying or a group slowly marching in prayer? Probably the former. I saw the head of the Danish community openly declare that the violence which has occurred as being an act against Islam. He also said that the violent individuals represent a very small percentage of Muslims. He went on to ask how these people could be so upset when the cartoons and the previous anti-immigrant articles did not affect them. This was done in a prime time newscast, so the moderate viewpoint is out there...unfortunately it is not as prevalent as the pictures of death and destruction.

As far as UBL goes, I would back the President 100% if he made a renewed effort to do everything he could to take him out. The unfortunate thing now, is that he would probably be seen as a martyr. In looking at international politics, it would probably be best to wait until this unrest dies down first. To kill him now would be like throwing fuel on a fire.

Just ran a search and the firs thing that came up is this:

http://www.mg.co.za/articlePage.aspx?articleid=263815&area=/insight/insight__national/

Not a large paper, but perhaps the biggies could take a lesson in responsible journalism to show all sides of an issue rather than just show the side which sells more copies or glues people to their televisons.

[Hamilton Reef]

'Toon Trouble 2/8/06
http://www.markfiore.com/animation/toon.html

[dtg]

'Toon Trouble 2/8/06
http://www.markfiore.com/animation/toon.html
Now that's funny!!!!! Good find HR!!!!

[upnut]

Here's a link to a Pakistan newspaper, and a glimpse at what the editorials there have to say: http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?date=2%2F11%2F2006

If you still think all the protests are spontaneous, make sure you read the editorial: View:Modernity and Protests by Muslims
"The cartoons were transmitted world-wide via a network of interlinked Islamist websites and portals, they were discussed and criticised in Islamist chat-rooms in cyberspace, and the protests against them were likewise organised and coordinated in cyberspace. How modern can Muslims get?

What we have seen therefore is clear evidence of a globalised Muslim world on the march. Islamist NGOs, parties, movements, civil society groups, media outlets and politicians have mobilised Muslims and got them on the streets to demonstrate the will of the Muslim masses and — more importantly — the power of the Muslim dollar. The boycott of Danish goods has shown that the Muslim dollar has clout — Muslims are rich, by the way — and that the Muslim dollar can make or break Western economies.

But beyond the spectacular aspect of these demonstrations and their equally spectacular results (leading to Western leaders cringing and begging for forgiveness on Arab-Muslim TV channels) "

Good reading, Scott B.

[RichP]

Online newspaper run by MSU instructor, students publishes controversial Danish cartoons

Muslim leader objects, says free speech is not the issue

February 27, 2006

By DAVID CRUMM

FREE PRESS RELIGION WRITER

Today, an online newspaper with links to Michigan State University’s journalism program became the first news outlet in the state to publish controversial Danish cartoons depicting the Prophet Muhammad.

The online publication drew immediate complaints from local Muslims and the Council on American-Islamic Relations, said Dawud Walid, Michigan director for the group.

Calling the cartoons offensive and the decision to post four of them in an online newspaper needlessly provocative, Walid said, “We want the cartoons taken down immediately.

“There is a very large Muslim student population at MSU,” he said. “You would think that a student newspaper would be sensitive to their own student body.”

However, Bonnie Bucqueroux, an MSU journalism instructor who pays for the online publication, called SpartanEdge, said she believes there’s a big difference between printed newspapers and news publications online.

“What we are doing is very different than a newspaper printing them, because if you open the pages of a newspaper, you’re going to see the cartoons,” Bucqueroux said. “It’s different than a TV station broadcasting these, because you don’t have a choice about what’s on the screen.”

On the SpartanEdge Internet site, Bucqueroux said, “You have to choose to see them.”

The top of the SpartanEdge home page today features a blue box and a photograph of Muslim protesters in Europe burning a Danish flag. The box contains the words, “Those infamous Danish cartoons — it’s your choice. Click here to see what the furor is all about — or don’t, if you would be offended.”

Clicking on the box brings up four of the most provocative Danish cartoons, including the image of Islam’s founder, the Prophet Muhammad, with a bomb in his turban.

MSU officials today distanced themselves from the Internet site, pointing out that it is not an official university publication. Bucqueroux pays for the site privately and the students working on the site are not doing so as a class project.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060227/NEWS11/60227006

[Munsterlndr]

I'd say that it is kind of overstating things to say "Muslims" in general are over reacting. I would qualify it to say "some" Muslims are over reacting. The ones that are tend to be fundamentalist and as we know fundamentalists in any religion tend to push the extremes. If you want to look in this country for an example look at Fred Phelps. I would hope that people of another faith could look at him and not say that all Christians are wacko's.

I'd also make another comment, relative to something Bwana mentioned. Of the Muslims who are overreacting, I would say that education, or relative lack thereof, does play a role in their propensity to engage in violent reactions. As has happened throughout history, the uneducated masses become pawns to be exploited by tyrants with an agenda. There is little wonder that some of these dictators are not educating their populace. It would probably result in getting them kicked out of power. That is one reason why I think it's important to differentiate between those types of countries and moderate, progressive Muslim countries that are actually making an attempt to educate their citizens and modernize their countries.

By the way, I thought the cartoon of Allah, telling the suicide bombers in heaven, that they were fresh out of virgins was pretty funny. :lol:

[Munsterlndr]

Public idiocy is not confined to Muslims. Sometimes good old Christians are idiots, too.

"Riots erupt in Dublin over a Parade"

http://u.tv/newsroom/indepth.asp?id=70837&pt=n

[PencilPlugger]

Public idiocy is not confined to Muslims. Sometimes good old Christians are idiots, too.

"Riots erupt in Dublin over a Parade"

http://u.tv/newsroom/indepth.asp?id=70837&pt=n

Here too: http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=129577