U.P Deer management/ Peaceful Protest

[WalleyeTracker]

In my photo album I have a couple of articles that many of you might enjoy reading I tried to put them on this page to no avail (lol) . They are on the whitetail management in the U.P and a peaceful protest that will be happening at the DNR's management meeting in Marquette Mi on Jan 17th from 6:00pm to 8:00pm All are welcome and encouraged to come if they can bring questions and picket signs:D, P.S if someone can put those articles in this thread it would be very much appreciated

[huntingfool43]

Here ya go

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/photopost/data/500/DNR_goals.jpg

http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/photopost/data/500/Protest.jpg

[WalleyeTracker]

Thanks HuntingFool Hopefully something will change to bring the U.P's herd back up to where it should be!:)

[UP Ed]

Hi Walleye Tracker,

Great to see you willing to spend time to organize folks. I would suggest you have a lot of folks in the meeting with suggests and comments as to what YOU want to see changed in deer management. Just my two cents.

-Ed

ps. I will be at the meeting Thursday in Baraga.

[Trophy Specialist]

I wish I could make it.

As POed as a lot of U.P. deer hunters are these days I hope it stays peaceful.

[Ed Spin04]

TS, I was led to believe that the cold weather in the UP kept the Yoopers cool in their composure. Have you ever seen any of them hot and lose their cool.

[2tundras]

Our meeting over here is the 12th. I would love to see some organized action. You think you guys had a bad year, I'll trade ya.

[yooperkenny]

TS, I was led to believe that the cold weather in the UP kept the Yoopers cool in their composure. Have you ever seen any of them hot and lose their cool.

Ed - Only if I catch ya

eying my woman in da sauna, or worse
droppin a line in my brookie spot!

[NorthJeff]

This exactly why I DON'T attend these meetings. The problem is that guys have no idea what the DNR does, or is even going to explain at the meetings. I have my doubts that very many of this group is fully informed on anything they are protesting and without being fully informed, well, it can turn into just a lot of noise that is not respected and irrelevent in the eyes of wildlife professionals.

I feel the DNR will do a good job of explaining deer numbers and issues, and although I do not agree with everything they will say, no one will get anywhere without making informed statements based on a lot more than just opinion.

The bottom line, winter severity and the lack of, or declining winter habitat is our greatest threat to deer numbers. If folks are protesting the loss of habitat, or carrying capacity of the land, and offer solutions...GREAT! But, bounties on predators will do nothing...in fact one of the best studies ever on predators suggests that unless predator efforts are continuous and aggressive efforts will be counterproductive, and when you have 10's of thousands of acres of wilderness tracts will few roads, you just can't control enough. As far as doe permits go, most areas with low deer numbers have no permits anyways...NONE, and some have NEVER had doe permits. Again, it boils down to the habitat amnd carrying capacity anyways. And then there is the magical "one buck license" that will do absolutely nothing. Again the problem is not the number of bucks that are being shot...only the age that they are being shot.

Again though, same concerns, same opinions, and although the DNR can do a better job in some areas a lot of folks protest the DNR without even knowing what they do, or what they will say....and I don't know why anyone would want to protest something before they even know what they are actually protesting.

How many have taken the time to phone your local district wildlife biologist or cheif biologist? Written letters? What about initiating any kind of personal and professional dialouge to just attempt a peaceful conversation with a wildlife official to genuinly seek answers? How many will become part of a protest, but have done nothing to attempt to communicate in any way with those they are protesting against? If you have take the time to do so, and had a good conversation without pointing fingers and being negative, asked questions, received answers, covered the angles, and still had enough reason to protest....that's great! But how many have taken the time to do that? Unless you have taken the time to personally communicate, get answers for yourself, speak to wildlife officials by yourself, then I don't see how someone could justify a protest, again, unless they are full informed.

Maybe everyone who is protesting has been personally fully informed, maybe they have taken the time and opportunity to do so...but if not, it can turn into just a bunch of noise and why bother? And someone can not say they don't have the time. If you have time to be a part of a protest for a couple hours...that is worth at least a 10 minute phone call to have a polite conversation with your local wildlife official.

[Luv2hunteup]

:yeahthat: Great post Jeff.

Improve the habitat and you'll improve deer numbers along with their physical condition. This should be the theme of the protest. I hope we never go back to the high deer numbers of the early 90s. Too many deer for too many years seriously damaged our winter deer range.

[Ed Spin04]

North Jeff, I think that you are telling us more truth than fiction, but don't you think that your input at these meetings would be a positive thing and get a few chronic naysayers to think again.

I have a frame of mind similar to yours Jeff, (see next issue of WNW) and planned to attend the meeting in Gladwin last month but couldn't. Wish I did, for I have been told that the input at that well atternded meeting was 99.9% anti DNR, with little fact to back up their useless tirade.

Some may think that I'm a DNR basher, not really I give them credit when it is due. I have always said, felt and still do, that the MDNR personnel are the ones with skills, training, field experience and education that makes them qualified to make informed decisions. That doesn't mean that they go about it in the most scientific way and have the best interest of the resources in mind. Politics and "keep the status quo" enter into their decisions much too often.

Jeff, you have facts that others should hear, let them hear it. The MDNR is not our enemy, let them know it, while they can also hear where they are short in courage

[BlockBUD]

Thank God for you, Jeff. Those are the very same reasons I don't attend the meetings. I didn't even attend the one at the high school where I teach! There are simply too many armchair deer experts that attend these meetings; they are the hunters who are pissed that they can't get a marvelous buck every year or because there are no deer...come on! They all have their unfounded reasons like the wolves are eating all the deer, etc. I put my trust in the DNR and learning from a few people on sites like this.

[WalleyeTracker]

This exactly why I DON'T attend these meetings. The problem is that guys have no idea what the DNR does, or is even going to explain at the meetings. I have my doubts that very many of this group is fully informed on anything they are protesting and without being fully informed, well, it can turn into just a lot of noise that is not respected and irrelevent in the eyes of wildlife professionals.

I feel the DNR will do a good job of explaining deer numbers and issues, and although I do not agree with everything they will say, no one will get anywhere without making informed statements based on a lot more than just opinion.

The bottom line, winter severity and the lack of, or declining winter habitat is our greatest threat to deer numbers. If folks are protesting the loss of habitat, or carrying capacity of the land, and offer solutions...GREAT! But, bounties on predators will do nothing...in fact one of the best studies ever on predators suggests that unless predator efforts are continuous and aggressive efforts will be counterproductive, and when you have 10's of thousands of acres of wilderness tracts will few roads, you just can't control enough. As far as doe permits go, most areas with low deer numbers have no permits anyways...NONE, and some have NEVER had doe permits. Again, it boils down to the habitat amnd carrying capacity anyways. And then there is the magical "one buck license" that will do absolutely nothing. Again the problem is not the number of bucks that are being shot...only the age that they are being shot.

Again though, same concerns, same opinions, and although the DNR can do a better job in some areas a lot of folks protest the DNR without even knowing what they do, or what they will say....and I don't know why anyone would want to protest something before they even know what they are actually protesting.

How many have taken the time to phone your local district wildlife biologist or cheif biologist? Written letters? What about initiating any kind of personal and professional dialouge to just attempt a peaceful conversation with a wildlife official to genuinly seek answers? How many will become part of a protest, but have done nothing to attempt to communicate in any way with those they are protesting against? If you have take the time to do so, and had a good conversation without pointing fingers and being negative, asked questions, received answers, covered the angles, and still had enough reason to protest....that's great! But how many have taken the time to do that? Unless you have taken the time to personally communicate, get answers for yourself, speak to wildlife officials by yourself, then I don't see how someone could justify a protest, again, unless they are full informed.

Maybe everyone who is protesting has been personally fully informed, maybe they have taken the time and opportunity to do so...but if not, it can turn into just a bunch of noise and why bother? And someone can not say they don't have the time. If you have time to be a part of a protest for a couple hours...that is worth at least a 10 minute phone call to have a polite conversation with your local wildlife official.






The only reason I placed this on here was to inform the public of the meeting and the PEACEFUL PROTEST not to start a war over what the DNR is doing right or wrong. I will be at the protest and will stand behind the people that feel the DNR needs a little push in the right direction. Jeff if your so knowlegable on the subject I really think you should be there to speak also you have a lot of good comments and maybe you can help all to understand the DNR's outlook on things!!!:16suspect