Some Facts worth Knowing.

[walleye express]

Got into what could have turned into an ugly discussion on another board with a couple of its members. (Ya...that don't sound like me does it? :yikes: :lol: ) Anyway, one of the posters pulled the old "Ignorance of the Law is no excuse" saying on me, when I mentioned some of the DNR's hunting and fishing laws as being written vague in their meanings, explanations and intentions. And then another fallowed with a presumption of an old misunderstood law about possession. So before it went any further and blew up, I went with the authority E-mail scenario. This may also bring up some questions about leaving smaller fish on the ice next to your hole to get them out of the system, thinking they're not part of your limit. I E-mailed him about that as well. You'll get the idea when you read it.



Capt Dan, Just because you have your limit doesn't mean you would have to stop fishing in MI. You can upgrade or catch and release. So technically the guy who punched his or her limit couldn't keep any additional fish but could still have lines in the water. Hunting is a little different, you can't shoot a goose and then let it go. Either way it's a pretty hard to enforce it unless someone doesn't know they are breaking the law and admit it to the officer. I know when river fishing for steelhead or salmon I've seen guys get busted because they shared a single stringer. The officer said whoever owned the stringer was in possesion of all the fish on it...seemed unfair to me because how is a stringer any different than cooler in a boat or a livewell for that matter.

Ed



Ed.

I respect your views but got some bad news for you, and some info that might help others thinking the same thing. I thought you might be wrong about having your limit and continuing to fish in Michigan. But before I took aim with the "Ignorance" word, I thought I'd E-mail (my good friend) and the Main C.O. Tony Soave, at the Bay City office. Read em and weep.

>>> 12/23/05 12:35 AM >>>
Tony.


I have a question for you. Is it legal to continue fishing for any specie of fish once you have the legal limit for that species in your possession? In other words can you legally continue fishing and cull smaller fish in your
possession from that limit? Dan.


Dan.
No, because you cannot Take or Attempt to Take a specific species of fish once you reach your limit. Attempt is part of the law. What happens alot is people throw smaller/dead fish or severely stressed fish from their bucket, livewell or laying on the ice back into the water and then the fish doesn't make it.

Same as targeting a closed species. Other than the new catch and release law for Bass ( which I highly disagree with) you also cannot target any species that is closed, whether you are catching and releasing or not. You are still "Attempting" to take.

Tony Soave, C.O.
Bay City Office.
soavea@michigan.gov

[waterfoul]

So you are saying that if you have 2 guys in the boat, 10 walleye, several at or just above the limit, you cannot continue fishing to cull the smaller ones? I was not aware of that.

[hoffie1]

Yep thats what it means.If you want to keep fishing either keep 8 or fish for something else.

[patcheroo]

I wonder if the guys in the MWC or FLW tours abide by, or know about that ..........Patch

[stampman]

While talking to a dnr officer on lake erie in Ohio about possession limits. He says " there is a 1/4 mile rule that, if you are with in 1/4 mile of the water all fish are considered possession". If you have 5 fish at your cabin, trailer, hotel, etc. and you are at the boat ramp with 5 more. They can consider that same day possession which would put you over your 1 day limit. Believe it or not that what he told me. The rule is for people double dipping.

[walleye express]

I just sent out another E-mail to my C.O. bud with another catch 22 question. If what he says above is true, and we know it is. Then is it legal for you and me to be trolling with (the Michigan legal) 2 rods each, once we have 9 walleyes in possession? That would put us at (one fish from the 2 man limit). Yet I've seen many instances where guys continue to troll with the legal amount of rods allowed per person when only one more fish is needed for a limit. So would that then put one of the fishermen in violation of fishing, after he has attained his limit? Getting an idea where I came up with that "vague understanding" concerning some of the rules/laws? :tdo12: :bash:

[WALLEYE MIKE]

I just sent out another E-mail to my C.O. bud with another catch 22 question. If what he says above is true, and we know it is. Then is it legal for you and me to be trolling with (the Michigan legal) 2 rods each, once we have 9 walleyes in possession? That would put us at (one fish from the 2 man limit). Yet I've seen many instances where guys continue to troll with the legal amount of rods allowed per person when only one more fish is needed for a limit. So would that then put one of the fishermen in violation of fishing, after he has attained his limit? Getting an idea where I came up with that "vague understanding" concerning some of the rules/laws? :tdo12: :bash:

Dan, one guy might already be over. He could have 6 and his bud has 3. :lol:

DNR can only prove that "if" they see every fish that was caught and by whom.

If 2 fisherman come into the dock with 11 walleyes and can't agree who caught what fish, who gets the ticket.

[walleye express]

If 2 fisherman come into the dock with 11 walleyes and can't agree who caught what fish, who gets the ticket.



Mike.

If its you and me coming in with 11, YOU DO. :tdo12: :yikes: :SHOCKED: :lol: I have a placard right on my boat that says "The Captain does not accept or pay any fines".

[fishin'magician']

"The Captain does not accept or pay any fines".[/QUOTE]



Cheapo:lol: , doesn't the capt control what happens on your vessel, I do on mine.

[walleye express]

"The Captain does not accept or pay any fines".



Cheapo:lol: , doesn't the capt control what happens on your vessel, I do on mine.[/QUOTE]


Yup....I do control what happens. I ask (without a physical search) if everybody has licenses, count and measure any fish that might look to short. If we get checked and any client is in violation. I.E you pay the fines and theres no debate. Thats when I point to the second placard I have posted. "The captain is always right" sometimes "Pig headed", "sloppy", "crude" "misinformed perhaps" and "often misunderstood", "but never wrong". ;) :D

[fishin'magician']

If the client is worthy a pat down my be necessary:D :D :D

[mkroulik]

I have an observation/question. They way this has all been written you're allowed to continue to fish for other species, so couldn't you just say you were trolling for whitebass, or some other species, to allow you to still have the max number of lines out? Or when salmon fishing, troll from steelhead. That to me seems perfectly legal. If fact, you could keep fishing even after the entire boat has their 3 per person limit of king salmon. Then what happens if you "accidentally catch" another salmon. If you immediately return it to the water, are you still in violation? From the wording of the response from the DNR, you would have to admit to still be trolling for walleye, or the attempt to take doesn't apply. I guess it's as much a moral question as it is a legality question. Just thought I'd see what everyone thought.

Mike

[walleye express]

I have an observation/question. They way this has all been written you're allowed to continue to fish for other species, so couldn't you just say you were trolling for whitebass, or some other species, to allow you to still have the max number of lines out? Or when salmon fishing, troll from steelhead. That to me seems perfectly legal. If fact, you could keep fishing even after the entire boat has their 3 per person limit of king salmon. Then what happens if you "accidentally catch" another salmon. If you immediately return it to the water, are you still in violation? From the wording of the response from the DNR, you would have to admit to still be trolling for walleye, or the attempt to take doesn't apply. I guess it's as much a moral question as it is a legality question. Just thought I'd see what everyone thought.

Mike


Mike.

I'm guessing (even before I get an answer back) that something like continuing to fish with all lines out falls under that "Gray Area" in the rules/laws, and is uninforceable in a court of law because of the reasons you mentioned. This then would negate getting a ticket for to many lines with just one fish to go for a 2 man limit. I'll post his answer when I get it. But he seems to insinuate that if your letting dinks die on the ice by your holes for any reason, they become part of your limit. This may finally be a legal reference to get people who do that to stop.

[mkroulik]

I was always under the impression that the fish on the ice counted towards your limit, especially if they die. I am sure that there are times we all have a couple dinks sitting on the ice for a minute or two when the school is in, but those fish will swim away and be fine.

Mike

[tkpolasek]

Patch
Tournaments don't allow for 2 man limits to be weighed in. Generally it is a 1 man limit that can be weighed and that is all they are allowed to have in the boat. So they legally can contiune to fish and cull fish unless the state or body of water has a no cull law. There are states that say once you put it in the livewell you can't remove it for a different fish.

Tim

[WALLEYE MIKE]

Mike.

If its you and me coming in with 11, YOU DO. :tdo12: :yikes: :SHOCKED: :lol: I have a placard right on my boat that says "The Captain does not accept or pay any fines".

Dan, lets say neither one of us is a captain, just 2 friends out fishing. Who know gets the ticket? Owner of the boat?

[walleye express]

Dan, lets say neither one of us is a captain, just 2 friends out fishing. Who know gets the ticket? Owner of the boat?


Oh....I didn't realize you were being serious. I guess if the ticket involved a case where both of us were in essence involved and at fault, we'd flip a coin to see whos name goes on the ticket, and then split whatever the fine was. Same as the gas, bait and the days expenses in my book. 50/50 ;) :p

[WALLEYE MIKE]

Dan, lets say neither one of us is a captain, just 2 friends out fishing. Who know gets the ticket? Owner of the boat?

Dan, found out if nobody confesses to the overlimit the boat operator gets it.